After Adacore's news thread, which managed to gather more than 450 comments in 6 hours, it's clear to me that something is wrong. Very wrong, in fact, and in order to look cool and impress internet people "help" the "community" solve "the problem" I'll try to summarize the main points raised against What The Fuck Dude That's a Horrible Idea.
Keran And Shy Cheated.
pro5 knew about it - I think this is the main talking point here, the bans are not new, they were set in motion quite a time ago, enough time in fact for keran to admit that he did indeed download a hack. zP kicked them, the community flamed them, everyone knew that keran and shy will get banned eventually. "But we weren't sure they were cheaters" is a pathetic excuse in this case.
It creates a nasty precedent - This is huge. With one fell swoop cb managed to completely destroy the work of various people trying to get the community distrustful of cheaters. Is it right, that after hours of making themselves look like idiots, the work of good men like evantjebraksiekensilolol and silentunderscore is destroyed? That small newspost is all it takes for making cheaters okay to play with. While some people didn't mind having a cheater or two in the lineup, most were still hestitant to add *]=45thid=[*BuZzzZ1337 to their cb roster. Now, well, what the hell, right?
It doesn't help anything - It's a game, man, get a life. In other words, it seems as if by not penalizing the whole team, cb made it personal. Massively personal, even, as every busted cheater, helix player, helix supporter and person-who's-name-starts-with-t can say "this is hardly fair, in this other situation something or other happened and NOW IT DIDN'T". And as childish as it may sounds, they may be right.
Imagine all the people - writing newsposts if pro5 win the EC? Is it really the sort of publicity an organization wants to attract? CB has been losing relevance lately, with worldcup, the 5on5 fiasco, and now this. I don't think having a team like that winning a major event is going to end well for them.
Added - The razz case - after reading some more comments on the newspost, it looks like people are saying "well you can't know if razz didn't use rivatuner in officials". You "can't know" if keran and shy used their cheats in an official either by that logic, so that argument doesn't hold. Please stop using it.
Not cool, CB.
Keran And Shy Cheated.
pro5 knew about it - I think this is the main talking point here, the bans are not new, they were set in motion quite a time ago, enough time in fact for keran to admit that he did indeed download a hack. zP kicked them, the community flamed them, everyone knew that keran and shy will get banned eventually. "But we weren't sure they were cheaters" is a pathetic excuse in this case.
It creates a nasty precedent - This is huge. With one fell swoop cb managed to completely destroy the work of various people trying to get the community distrustful of cheaters. Is it right, that after hours of making themselves look like idiots, the work of good men like evantjebraksiekensilolol and silentunderscore is destroyed? That small newspost is all it takes for making cheaters okay to play with. While some people didn't mind having a cheater or two in the lineup, most were still hestitant to add *]=45thid=[*BuZzzZ1337 to their cb roster. Now, well, what the hell, right?
It doesn't help anything - It's a game, man, get a life. In other words, it seems as if by not penalizing the whole team, cb made it personal. Massively personal, even, as every busted cheater, helix player, helix supporter and person-who's-name-starts-with-t can say "this is hardly fair, in this other situation something or other happened and NOW IT DIDN'T". And as childish as it may sounds, they may be right.
Imagine all the people - writing newsposts if pro5 win the EC? Is it really the sort of publicity an organization wants to attract? CB has been losing relevance lately, with worldcup, the 5on5 fiasco, and now this. I don't think having a team like that winning a major event is going to end well for them.
Added - The razz case - after reading some more comments on the newspost, it looks like people are saying "well you can't know if razz didn't use rivatuner in officials". You "can't know" if keran and shy used their cheats in an official either by that logic, so that argument doesn't hold. Please stop using it.
Not cool, CB.
i just edited my profile . u must care about that !
the newspost did strike me as smacking of delayed & forced brownie pointing
Seeing teams at such a high level with cheaters in their lines makes at least me lose motivation to write about the scene. Those issues damage the image of the whole competitive et scene. As a newsposter, a cup admin, a clan manager or whatever you are - you put a lot of work into this scene because you respect the hard training and sportsmanship of the teams - but whats left to respect now?
(I know that I stole this quote out of the context ;>)
Stop blaming CB for all your problems and be happy they do something.
But it is necessary to be sure that everybody knows your rules and what could happen if he will not follow these rules.
Therefore it must be clear what will happen to a stupid teenager testing cheats on a public server (yes teenager are often testing forbidden things) and what we do with an evil criminal cheater doing everything possible and necessary to get a lot of money or to achieve great honor in a nasty way.
Yes, we know that it is very difficult to detect cheats nowadays because proven facts are always needed and difficult to get. In such a situation it is necessary to have long ban times for a public-cheater and especially for players using cheats in official matches. Otherwise our beloved game and the whole esport will be destroyed.
Did you tell your teammates that you are not willing to tolerate cheats in your team or clan and what should happen if someone uses cheats? It is very difficult to ban a cheater for a long time without talking about rules before. Be sure that everybody knows what will happen in such a situation. This is so important. Discuss the rules with your teammates! Do they tolerate a player downloading and testing cheats at home or on a public server? What will be the consequences for you?
In my opinion clanbase often made the right decision, but in the case of keran it takes too long and P5 won their match against dignitas with keran playing. Shit happens, clanbase, or what? This situation is not good...not for keran (yes he made a mistake and should take the ban time to understand that testing cheats is not worth the trouble, but he is not guilty being allowed to play against dignitas) or for P5 and each member (if they will win eurocup there will be always a black spot) or for clanbase (if it takes time to check the cheater then stop playing, otherwise this is a distortion of competition).
But look at soccer, a red card in the national league do not take effect in the world cup for example. Otherwise it will be a distortion of competition. So, why should cheating on a public be interesting for eurocup? This comparison is wrong because cheating is like doping and not comparable to a certain foul or behaviour in a single match.
Look at the rules of the leagues before your team takes part and discuss them. You cannot criticize the rules or the league admins afterwards. But if the admins don't use their rules in the right way, we have a situation to discuss. Why do they need so much time for their decision? What were the difficulties? Keran didn't deny that he was using cheats on a public, or did he?
Therefore give him a ban time of 4 instead of 6 months, for example, but do it faster.
In professional sports, bans after the fact happen ALL THE TIME. Seriously, wake the fuck up. This is how things happen in the real world.
Some people seem to think that because a lot of people play a game that it's somehow entitled to an official govening body which dedicates its time to dealing with cheating/doping/foul play issues.
If gaming is expected to enter the mainstream of competitive sports/e-sports then you have to expect a transitional period where the community feels it needs an authority to make these decisions, but it doesn't have anyone who's dedicated to dealing with the task.
On one hand people just think it will happen, as if by magic, just because a lot of people play it. On the other, they don't want to acknowledge that administering a proper competitive environment takes procedures and processes. And a lot of work.
Frankly, the point is made more laughable by the fact that it's based on a result. If the score had been reversed then would it have got the same attention ? No. Which means that people are less concerned about how the game deals with cheats and more about whether cheats win. If you want to be taken seriously, it shouldn't matter.
On a personal note, I thought the Razz ban was a joke given that I'm sure a significant number of the top players breathed a sigh of relief it wasn't them who got banned - but it's kind of irrelevant tbh, he was used as an example and in proper sports shit like that happens.
Deal with it.
I dont get all that mess tbh.
Try to look at all p5 actions from the point of view of the admin who sticks to the rules. Can you, sitting in that POV, say that p5 were against the rules by playing with not (yet) banned player (no matter if he admited he cheated or not)? in your feelings its wrong, but is it against the rules? You can dislike p5 guys but you cant say they are guilty.
And if they win EC what then? What would those all people write? If p5 win EC that would mean they were the best? But easy, they wont :)
not rly a nice read
EDIT: and yes, i think rules are bad atm :D