The case of Lio and alexl is one that would have Columbo himself in a muddle! The case of two of the games opposites being tarred with the same brush. Lio a player who has worked his way up from obscurity and proven 4 times on LAN that slowly but surely he has climbed the ladder of skill to great effect. alxel a player who started off the way he has finished, a banned cheater - somewhere in the middle some believed him to possess a fair amount of skill and that had he not made mistakes as a young’n he would now be welcomed as a good player.
Both of them kicked at the same time, in the same match for the same offence and now banned for the same amount of time.
If this had happened just to alexl it'd be simple, hes been a cheater before and this just confirms the idea that cheaters never change, a thought reinforced by countless cheaters in the games history. However it didn’t, It happened Lioco also a player whom despite manys dislike of him does command respect as a player who, as proven at CDC4 can out damage many of ET top players and suddenly out of the blue he’s been put into the same jar as the scum of the game.
Many have complained at Clanbase for their decision to ban these players, but really those who are complaining at Clanbase for this are idiots. Clanbase have to ban based off what they’ve been given otherwise every other cheater would be free to play once again. Some say that its got something to do with an argument Lio and DoneX had in a nationscup game and that if this argument hadn’t happened there would have been at least some delay or Spanish inquisition into the situation but personally I don’t buy that, Clanbase are in my opinion blameless in this scenario (once again, I really don’t work for CB).
The fact they are banned is inevitable, the fact that they are cheaters is in my opinion (for Lio) unbelievable.
Many are looking to one of two explanations – either a) someone did something via MSN to transmit something that got them flagged by punkbuster or b) Punkbuster itself was exposed and hacked. It looks from what I’ve been told that option B is the most likely and that personally is quite surprising. In this journal you can see that its not too far fetched a proposal and I know that a couple of people are trying to see how possible it is.
However, why Lio AND Alexl? There is nothing that ties these two together, they are from different ET worlds. Lio is disliked there is no doubt of that and he alone would make sense, but then why take Alexl out at the same time. If you read the screenshots from conversation logs with idiots who claim to know something then Alexl was unlucky or an accident, so surely there is something technically that ties them together?
If you’re a random hacker and you posses the powers to single handily have Punkbuster kick any player in ET why these two and why not all of the Belgian side? Heck, anyone and everyone. So much of the story just doesn’t add up as to why these two were kicked. For Lio there was never any suspicion, in nearly every case prior many have had an idea or a thought that they were cheating which is why if it had happened to Alexl only I wouldn’t be writing this column and nobody would care that he’d been kicked.
The reality of the situation that we’re in, is that Lio’s reputation has earned him peoples attention and rejection at the ruling now that he’s been kicked. Which I don’t think has ever happened before, is that a right thing? Well I for one think yes it is – if Winghaven was kicked for the same thing then I’d hope there was a revolt also, its heart warming to see that even people that dislike Lio have stuck up for him. However if Lio is proven innocent, then faith in Punkbuster will die within a second of the news being released and that would fuck ET right up, so even if Lio wins, ET loses.
However that doesn’t solve the problem and the reality is I’ve no clue what does. Technically I know nothing, I trust a handful of people that do and they’re all baffled by what happened to the pair of them. However for the time being, one of ET’s success stories sits on the sidelines - surely something is wrong with this picture?
Both of them kicked at the same time, in the same match for the same offence and now banned for the same amount of time.
If this had happened just to alexl it'd be simple, hes been a cheater before and this just confirms the idea that cheaters never change, a thought reinforced by countless cheaters in the games history. However it didn’t, It happened Lioco also a player whom despite manys dislike of him does command respect as a player who, as proven at CDC4 can out damage many of ET top players and suddenly out of the blue he’s been put into the same jar as the scum of the game.
Many have complained at Clanbase for their decision to ban these players, but really those who are complaining at Clanbase for this are idiots. Clanbase have to ban based off what they’ve been given otherwise every other cheater would be free to play once again. Some say that its got something to do with an argument Lio and DoneX had in a nationscup game and that if this argument hadn’t happened there would have been at least some delay or Spanish inquisition into the situation but personally I don’t buy that, Clanbase are in my opinion blameless in this scenario (once again, I really don’t work for CB).
The fact they are banned is inevitable, the fact that they are cheaters is in my opinion (for Lio) unbelievable.
Many are looking to one of two explanations – either a) someone did something via MSN to transmit something that got them flagged by punkbuster or b) Punkbuster itself was exposed and hacked. It looks from what I’ve been told that option B is the most likely and that personally is quite surprising. In this journal you can see that its not too far fetched a proposal and I know that a couple of people are trying to see how possible it is.
However, why Lio AND Alexl? There is nothing that ties these two together, they are from different ET worlds. Lio is disliked there is no doubt of that and he alone would make sense, but then why take Alexl out at the same time. If you read the screenshots from conversation logs with idiots who claim to know something then Alexl was unlucky or an accident, so surely there is something technically that ties them together?
If you’re a random hacker and you posses the powers to single handily have Punkbuster kick any player in ET why these two and why not all of the Belgian side? Heck, anyone and everyone. So much of the story just doesn’t add up as to why these two were kicked. For Lio there was never any suspicion, in nearly every case prior many have had an idea or a thought that they were cheating which is why if it had happened to Alexl only I wouldn’t be writing this column and nobody would care that he’d been kicked.
The reality of the situation that we’re in, is that Lio’s reputation has earned him peoples attention and rejection at the ruling now that he’s been kicked. Which I don’t think has ever happened before, is that a right thing? Well I for one think yes it is – if Winghaven was kicked for the same thing then I’d hope there was a revolt also, its heart warming to see that even people that dislike Lio have stuck up for him. However if Lio is proven innocent, then faith in Punkbuster will die within a second of the news being released and that would fuck ET right up, so even if Lio wins, ET loses.
However that doesn’t solve the problem and the reality is I’ve no clue what does. Technically I know nothing, I trust a handful of people that do and they’re all baffled by what happened to the pair of them. However for the time being, one of ET’s success stories sits on the sidelines - surely something is wrong with this picture?
it's cb's decision that has to be proven right or wrong, or not?
or did the people at PB comment on this, saying hacking their sytem is impossible?
I might not be up to date.
We might all be in danger, especially those who arent that well liked...
no reason why lio would ever cheat
another 2 bit the dust.
Banning the whole Belgian team would be to ridiculous.
Lio has never cheated , and never will , many of you have already stood up for their friends but in my case this is totally different. He has always been the best , i don't see any reason why he should hack.
I hope this gets fixed soon so we can still play EC , else it's over.
Until someone proves that there is a problem with PB, AFAIK there's proof that lio has been busted. PB have already said that this bug/hack doesn't apply to ET in the journal that TosspoT linked to.
If not, he and alexl were just the unlucky targets of some random guy who obivously did something that got them pb banned. I do hope that pb gives more information in the nearby future, it could be just the thing people need(/want) to know.
or not? :)
well, i hate you, because you warp like shit....yet your ban is kinda ridiculous.....so, if it helps in any way...i know that matt has or had a team called zeight or zeights, and i know that they are those who did this to you (cant remember the nicks on vent, cuz i just joined the wrong channel)
they could kick you cuz they got your ip through irc or smth, that s what i heard em say.
thes were trying to kick you again but you seemed to have irc turned off...well whatsoever, i hope this hellps, if not...gl in rl.
dont consider me liking you anyway -.- and if you mnake this public, keep my name out of it.
This is something I got from someone that doesn't wanna reveal his real name, I have been looking for these guys, irc channel whatever but haven't been able to find them, if anyone would have more info just send me in pm, thx!
Do you have a bnc - cause that wud make that even more far fetched.
btw have u tried the most obvious of things that is formatting?
Not that this scenario would raise my eye browns at alll, just my two cents to this subject.
me2: Im trying as hard as I can :'(
me1: HARDER I SAY YOU FAGGOT
me2: but I caaaaaaant :'(((((((((((
me1: GOD DAMNIT YOU PRICK TRY HAAARDEEEEER
(RANDOM IRC LOG) I think there'll be a new on nC on monday or tuesday
does not mean its automatically true and sounds quite far fetched
This has all gotten quite a lot of attention.
in case of lio: can't possibly believe he ever cheated, along with both him and alexl getting kicked at the same time: its obviously a bug. Has the kick been confirmed by finding the MBI of punkbuster? Anyway, I dont expect ppl defending edit, neither do I see CB changing it ruling unless they find black and white proof that it was a bug.
now, I am not saying these guys cheated and I havent studied the whole case. but, fact of the matter is pb detected a cheat. it cant be hard to prove someone was messing with the system. until this has been proven, the ban is simply logical and justified.
how often have we seen cheaters avoiding ban because there wasn't any solid (enough) proof? by excluding PB detection as solid proof it becomes almost impossible to ever ban anyone for cheats.
Any of them getting unbanned just because "omagad he was such pwnz0r on LAN" will mean that this game is worth nothing.
Very difficult to believe that lio cheated though
The reason why it was known that it couldn't be lio himself was because the player banned was Dutch and the IP traced back to Holland.
Perhaps remind the C&A people to look into that as this event could be interpreted as someone already trying to frame him. He failed as the IP did not match and CB's policy requires a 100% match of HID's, IP's and GUIDs.
CB's policy of being very strict and requiring each case to be full proof in these cases pays off by being very thorough. If this information had been found by other cup organizers, I think lio would have been in a world of trouble and flame. CB does deserve some credit for it's discretion.
In CB's case, they work with certain important assumptions that particular sources such as MBL, Punkbuster etc are reliable sources. Hence, why they base their current ban on it.
However, even if there is a hypothetical chance that PB's info is not 100% proof anymore, there assumption of PB info being waterproof will certainly be dropped.
Once that happens, lio will be off the hook.
experience with perfo's case is that that is not the case, ip alone for whatever reason is apparently sufficient for a ban
The guid and ip linked it on cb to his HID and the ip's logged on the site.
my yawn is not red, not a SINGLE one of my yawn entries is red
a) they are 2 stupid to instal old hacks
b) somebody hacked PB
c) the MSN thingy
d) some random driver error or smth
Unless Evenbalance acknowledges that the specific violation is caused by having a certain [non cheat] program running (has happened before).
It would be nice if Lio or alexL informed the community of what evenbalance's response was.
Moreover, you might have Infinity Ward knocking on Evenbalance door to get their money back.
Just from a business point of view.
I'm not saying that's what it was, but they could at least blame that. :)
Anyway, I would say that the ban in barrysplanet's post below indicates that it's not from a hacked PB server.
Thats what he got when connected to a streaming server.
GUID Overview
ET a2afdc8d9bcf8bd95b2ae1c4ae6987d5
(PBBans)
Dates Feb 26, 2008 at 3:03 pm -- Mar 13, 2008 at 4:02 pm
Alias(s) (18)
belgian allstar
cZarlio
ECPlayer
EDiT lio
EDiT-lio STEELSHIT
franchement,heyheyhey!!!
gamehack|lio ESSO
gamehack|lio ESSO
gurkhas lio
lio
lollipop|lio ESSO
ect // ect // ect
Mar 10, 2008
Viol #80332 Violation (GAMEHACK) #80332
gamehack|lio ESSO (81.82.167.167)
Telenet (82.192.78.6:27960)
IP address 81.82.167.167
Hostname d5152A7A7.access.telenet.be
ISP Telenet Operaties N.V.
Country Belgium
He has all ready said he got this when he connected to Telenet 1 82.192.78.6:27960 .... Question is, how did it get onto his pc.
Hope this will get sorted out as soon as possible!
Columbo ftw! :)
Chie of aliens: we found a way to fuck everyone who's using pb without even hacking into PB
Chief of aliens: I think there'll be a new on nC on monday or tuesday!
Chief of aliens: oHmmm hemm.. i forgot, did u get a plan to conquest the planet earth?
Random IRCLOG
Osama: Ok Azuz did a great job
Osama: the idea of ban axeL and Lio was great. Now noone will work anymore or sleep or eat or do anything, untill the mystery is solved... And obviously it won't be solved!!!!!oneone!!!!
Osama: Muahahahahaha the world will be mine!!!!
ps: tosspot plz phone to scotland yard so they can solve your drama and finally u will be able to live again... if u ever lived
... hitting the rock bottom ...
What if this is some kind revenge now? What if in upcoming nc or ec games more players get kicked for gamehack? That would be the perfect way for nC to clear the way for their customers, because more and more people would lose trust in the pb system.
VIEZE HOEREZOOOOONe
I for one find it fucking hilarious.
Anyway, i have appealed the bans with all the info i have got ...
An answer is yet to be received by CB Anticheat team and by Punkbuster.
Regards,
nice whine tosspot.. if he is your friend or someone who you know, then it is possible the PB is wrong. LOL... how ppl become subjective...
And the outcome is?
n1ce ;)