Power of community? what is it? I've seen power of this community twice. First, when we send our team on quakecon. Gnajda case is second time.
I say it simply. ET is not dying. Its impossible to kill game with such enormous fan support. However, we are going to end our game by our hands. Just look what we can do: force clanbase to ban a player. We're breaking one of most important features of nowdays courts and judgment system. Independence of judges is holy. Still we broke that law. I'm not saying that gnajda is clean, maybe he isnt. But maybe he is. And what if he is clean? We punished innocent person. Just think what if mAus appered now, not some time ago. Great player, great aimer. But he would be banned, because of our fault. Because we would force clanbase to ban him! Its normal that, when new bright star of gaming appers, the old crew think: he must be cheating, it impossible to play at such level, with so little experience. But its possible. Now lets go back to gnajda. Ok he is banned. We all laught from his "I wont go to lan, my girfriend forbids it". but this ban is stealing chance for him to prove his innocence. Clanbase banned players cant attend cdc. And nowdays not many western players respect polish lans. Look at naga, player that was accused even by polish players. But he played at 2 lans. And twice he played at really good level. Dont give me this shit: "there are no decent teams in poland" because its not true. We got 3-4 teams at OC premier, EC skill. In my opinion its enough to became lanproofed. Especialy in situation like in this EC, when only few teams can compete at same skill level.
If we are talking about teams,im wondering on one little thing. Why FF got kicked out of EC? Im rather newschool player, and i remember only 2 eurocups with cheating problem. Firstly there is razz and team helix. We all know razz sad story. And we all know how it ended for his clan. They got expeled from tournament. AND after some time and another cheating problem, Clanbase admited that their decision was wrong, and helix should should be not punished.
Second case I remember is story of public cheat. Yes perfo keran and shy recived bans for cheating on public server. Whatevah. Important in this case is fact that teams they have played in were not removed from EC. Its the time when cb admited that helix should stay in ec. So now we have third case of cheating in Eurocup. And again Clanbase changes their minds, and Fear Factory is expeled. Something is not right or I am stupid polish fag. BUT lets assume that FF was kicked rightly. In that case why Team Coolermasters is not given a chance to play against overload? Gnajda played also against them. I see no logic here.
Think about it before you will write any replys.
UPDATE: I see many of you missed my point. This column was made not to defend gnajda, but to show you guys force of this community which may lead to bans for clean players.
I also wanted to know why TCM ere not given a chance to play against ovr.
I say it simply. ET is not dying. Its impossible to kill game with such enormous fan support. However, we are going to end our game by our hands. Just look what we can do: force clanbase to ban a player. We're breaking one of most important features of nowdays courts and judgment system. Independence of judges is holy. Still we broke that law. I'm not saying that gnajda is clean, maybe he isnt. But maybe he is. And what if he is clean? We punished innocent person. Just think what if mAus appered now, not some time ago. Great player, great aimer. But he would be banned, because of our fault. Because we would force clanbase to ban him! Its normal that, when new bright star of gaming appers, the old crew think: he must be cheating, it impossible to play at such level, with so little experience. But its possible. Now lets go back to gnajda. Ok he is banned. We all laught from his "I wont go to lan, my girfriend forbids it". but this ban is stealing chance for him to prove his innocence. Clanbase banned players cant attend cdc. And nowdays not many western players respect polish lans. Look at naga, player that was accused even by polish players. But he played at 2 lans. And twice he played at really good level. Dont give me this shit: "there are no decent teams in poland" because its not true. We got 3-4 teams at OC premier, EC skill. In my opinion its enough to became lanproofed. Especialy in situation like in this EC, when only few teams can compete at same skill level.
If we are talking about teams,im wondering on one little thing. Why FF got kicked out of EC? Im rather newschool player, and i remember only 2 eurocups with cheating problem. Firstly there is razz and team helix. We all know razz sad story. And we all know how it ended for his clan. They got expeled from tournament. AND after some time and another cheating problem, Clanbase admited that their decision was wrong, and helix should should be not punished.
Second case I remember is story of public cheat. Yes perfo keran and shy recived bans for cheating on public server. Whatevah. Important in this case is fact that teams they have played in were not removed from EC. Its the time when cb admited that helix should stay in ec. So now we have third case of cheating in Eurocup. And again Clanbase changes their minds, and Fear Factory is expeled. Something is not right or I am stupid polish fag. BUT lets assume that FF was kicked rightly. In that case why Team Coolermasters is not given a chance to play against overload? Gnajda played also against them. I see no logic here.
Think about it before you will write any replys.
UPDATE: I see many of you missed my point. This column was made not to defend gnajda, but to show you guys force of this community which may lead to bans for clean players.
I also wanted to know why TCM ere not given a chance to play against ovr.
bb gnajda bb slajdan
but seriously.. u wanna tell me u can compare gnajda with maus?
naga: pwning on a lan where 90% are low+ enemys its not rly hard... which shouldn´t say i accuse him of cheating.. tbh i never specced him playing.. and only played 2-3 times against him
why FF got kicked? cause maybe teams & clans will learn not u take such a guy.. when everyone knows he is hacking. Sad for FF.. but hopefully the clan,the team and the rest of the community learns to avoid playing with or against cheaters
about the 2nd cheater case i´m not sure.. but if it was only pub-cheating they never cheated in a offi... so that could be a reson not to kick the whole team. but i´, not sure if its proofen that he only cheated on pub besides that everyone belived that perfo didn´t cheat in offis.. he played on lan against alot of decent teams.. and that on a high lvl like online
and dont tell me savak aka eliteplayers, fear factory and replay devilry[ former atoon squad] are low+ ...
didn´t he played with FF on that lan`well then there have been 2 enemys for him... eliteplayers & auth
dont wanna watch the matches of his team.. but i guess he didn´t played against one of them.. and then i would also like to see the demos of that match
how did he played against these enemys? As far as i know half of the auth team said that he sucked pretty hard at the lan. But i´m not sure.. maybe i´m changeing the names in my head so propably it was someone else from the team.
@edit: from which lan r u talking btw? there have been 2 ?
and cheaters wont kill et... retards will
and gnadja can't go to LAN because his imaginary GF says eh can't go.
And I think it's right that FF got kicked because gnadja was prolly cheating during EC (something perfo, keran and shy didn't) and FF knew that gnadja was cheating or atleast that he was very suspicious and that he played with alot of cheaters before.
And about naga, he didn't had that much suspicious actions at LAN than he has durign online matches and the opponent was low+ there nothing compared to CDC.
naga only owned online and some low+ lan, but on LAN against those low+ he had less suspicious actions then he has online vs more skilled players.
The comments on here seem to think the fact that he is polish it possible to ban him, or that hes any more of a cheater because hes polish. No its not, hes a cheater along with all the Brit's, Dutch, Swedish, French and German cheaters he is hated just as much as them because he is a cheater, not because he is polish.
comparing qcon with a random cheater = no way
i can name much more stuff that the community achieved which is much more worthy:
stopped 5on5 etc.
im just here for off topic chatting, sry for answering in this et thread :(
look @ worms comment, u will find a true retard :X
Btw. whatever you wrote here, I disagree >D.
and im not blind... i dont see anything wrong with gnajda... some lotto + good aim
and pls remind me from when cb is using anti3 as anti cheat tool
and same rules for everybody
so either all teams play with 12 players or with 11 as normal.
It's the same with anti3 if CB adds it because a part of the community wants it, the whole community should use anti3 if they want to play CB.
So if polaks starts to play with 12 players in their own compo's then it oke, but they should stick to the UEFA rules for UEFA matches.
so the UEFA only has to think about it and then say no because it are only the polaks who need 12 players to win over 11, same as in ET where they need hacks to win :P
But I can understand ur anger since the only polish team who seemed to be clean for a long time got kicked out EC. But it's their own fault, they coudl see that gnadja was obvious and that he played with a lot of cheater before and they still play with him.
We have to give a sign that playing with cheaters isn't the way to go, and kicking FF out of EC is the first step.
There is no real proof that he hacked, but thats also what you have in court. If somebody had a gun in his hand and somebody got killed with that gun the person who left the fingerprints get busted while he didn't have to fire the gun at the place of the delict. And we got a Anti3 fail @ gnadja and lots of obvious demos/avi's and that he played with loads of cheaters before.
u say that kicking FF is first step to "clean" et from cheaters, but tell my why evolve gaming and pro5 were not kicked out? cb had proofs[ yeah proofs little thing they cant find on gnajda]
So pro5 didn't had any benefits from the cheats they used, FF needed gnajda cheat to win vs impact and ovr.
You see the point here? Or are you still to proud of ur polish heratige and you still think that nobody in poland is cheating?
And you still think playing EC with a cheater is a good thing to do?
Because thats what you are saying, just play EC with cheaters only he get kicked and you can win eZBash just recruit 50 cheaters and you can use 3 per match to have a eZBash and win EC. The whole teams doesn't need to be kicked because that woulod be fucked up for the clean players.
Well don't play with cheaters if you don't wanna be kicked out of cups!
and cb had really solid proofs against keran shy perfo
- he's suspicious for a very long time
- every demo has 50+ suspicious actions in it
thats enough proof for me, because:
- etpro guid can be spoofed (etpro devs even say not to use it because it's buggy)
- data send to yawn can be faked (pbguid, ip)
- server logs can be faked
- cf, cb, gtv can be visited using proxy so a IP can sometimes never been made
And ofc everybody has suspicious moves, but not as much as him even perfo didn't had that when people thought he was using wallhack.
how long mAus, butchji perfo were suspicious?
50 strange actions o0... i think we didnt spec same player...
its like i said - u dont know what kind of information player get @ vent, many of so called obvious situations are nothing special[lotto factor]...from 50 u get 10?
Seems like kot is the only one not defending cheaters
and im not cheater lover, its just i see no proofs to ban gnajda, and i see no reason why FF was kicked out, when evolve and pr5 wasnt
You can whine on about not having proof as much you want because nobody can give them, but everybody (except you and some other polak fags) can see he's cheating.
If gnajda is a hacker he used it during the EC matches, perfo/keran/shy didn't use it during EC matches. Thats why FF got punished and pro5 and evolve not.
So this is not a valid point for you anymore!
and i think now get it... ff is kicked out because they maybe have a cheater in team... smart.. lets kick out all cb teams, they may have cheaters!
CB sees him as a hacker, and then he used the hacks CB (and 90% of the ET community) thinks he has during EC matches.
Thats the reason FF got kicked out, because CB admins have declared gnajda as a hacker which used his hack in a CB EC match.
They can do whatever they want it their cup, and for once they listen to the community and now all polaks statr whining because they banned a cheating polak (it seems to be only polaks think he doesn't cheat)
You can also start whining about the point that perfo was banned in 24 hours and keran and shy where still able to play some matches while they were allready busted. Is it fair no, but nothing in the world is fair.
im just trying to prove that listening to the community is wrong, cause it may end with ban for a clean player...
and gnajda is perfect subject... just look at all comments in this thread... i was being offended becaus my opinion is different from community opinion...
its kinda paranoic that every new player must be a cheater...
But thats good, cause I was about to read this "column".
Thanks.
What kot has do to with any thing of this? He just don't like cheaters and there is not 'but' there.
You claim that is envy - based on what? That he wrote, he doesn't like cheaters, that would be odd if he liked them
please, if you have no idea how something works, don't post stupid claims
And about CB's behaviour, this only shows how pathetic admins they have. They were compromised so many times so they had to do something to endear themselves to all those criers.
its hilarious... guy played this game for 4 years... 3o3 at highest level... and still he cannot shoot well
gnajda, razz - no proofs
omg zomg pl0x?
The problem is that he will be banned (I believe the ban has already been issued) after a demo review. The problem is not the ban itself but the reason with which it has been justified.
This whole wortless argument we have here could have been easily avoided even now, if only the CB crew justified the recently issued ban with the anti3 incident and not with some doubtful demo review...
it sounds like u want to compare gnajda with maus/butchji/mystic or who ever is a great aimer for u... but i can´t see 100 wh-avi´s about them. and i think kot one of the best polish players won´t think like you.. or the rest of the top-level polish player ?
so who is left of your "whole polish community" ? gnajds "friends" , alot of hackers and maybe some weird random guys ?!
You might be right if u say.. banning a player just because of a demo is bullshit..
but he got banned cause tons of avi´s & demos & strange actions.. not jsut because of one nice scene in a game.. or propably 3-4 nice scenes because he got a nice day... he seems to have in nearly every match a überday with strange knowings and a überaim which no one in this community has.
and just watch some butchji/mAus/mystic ettv matches with shownormals turned on.. maybe u find this 100wh-avi
The funniest thing is that people who have something against me have never talked to me and base their opinions on some ridiculous rumours.
I've already heard that I said I was gonna rape Finland in NC all by own, that I think I'm a god, that I asked sol to ban FF players from crossfire and that I don't think that any Polish team other than my own deserves to be in the EC final, none of which is true. I'm not really concerned about FF or any other Polish team and I don't give a fuck about what they do :-)
LIKE THIS?????
2. i dont know anything about kot & his image at the polish community.. neither i care about it but i guess he isn´t the only one with such a opinion...and his attitude is completly the right one. And i think someone who playes on a top-level of his country can know who of his nation is skilled , who is not and who suddenly came and plays like god
and if u dont know gnajda is playing et for 4 years, and dunno how long @ highets 3o3 skill level...
and as i wrote my intend was not to defend gnajda but any other player that may be banned caus of xfire "omg he shoot 3 hs must be a cheater" guys...
gnajda on a high level since years :DDD
and ye i rly guess u know what top aimer can do.. i´m rly sure...
i guess i should have better used [ironic] tags..
and it's a bit too obvious how gnajda's playing, mAus is good, but he can't track that good as this polish "talent" can
oh and idd, polish lans don't mean a thing, just a bunch of cheaters together - apart from the diversus/netrunners team
im not native speaker, so i may make some grammar mistakes... still if u understood what i wrote i see no problem... [u see cause u are belgian whiner]
and mAus was much more obvious than gnajda, especially if we take in consideration that he is playing this game 4 years...
oh and your last sentence proved how much retarded you are :X
EAT MY FUCKING CAPSLOCK FAG.
how it was?
random
unknown
polish
and you dissconnected after geting bashed by my friend?
whole comminuty doesnt see what is happening...
new good player = cheater
thats how it is here @ xfire
And plz, fix ur grammar. Not asking Shakespeare but this is ... sad. Its impossible to kill a game and its a public cheat etc...
This case is actually different from perfo's, shy's and keran's because gnajda was found guilty of cheating in EC games, thus making a direct influence on their outcome. On a sidenote, I think that razz's case was handled properly and the change in CB's policy after that was not a right one :c
failed, epically.
No-one questioned Allu's ban, what's different now?
PS. It also seems like FF, as a team, are taking ET relatively seriously in contrast to Impact.
Would be nice if you had done at least some research, cause u got your facts wrong. CB doenst care about xfire, nor does it care about some hate channels on IRC. Go talk with the people who made the decision and you'll see the pressure from the community didnt have any effect at all. When did CB ever listen to popular opinion anyway? They banned him by using demos, taking into consideration all the circumstantial evidence.
you ARE allowed to go to cdc5 while banned, and it is a very nice and clever decision by tosspot.
While people being banned for "aimbot" on demo get 12 months. :-DDDD
Atleast they could have waited for someone with proper knowledge(a coder) to analyze the demos? But no, the admins lie and stress it and ignores queries completely.
CB have spoken and theres nothing anyone can do about it so find a better use for your fingers instead of typing, maybe try picking your nose?
I said CB have spoken, they have the final decision and like they care what a bunch of kiddies say?
1.A cheater got a well deserved ban
2.People are whining about it to much
3. gnajda has allot of fanboys
4.Nothings going to change by you writing this article so you have wasted your time.
5. I might be dumb but im not dumb enough to write a dumb article like yours.
So you admit that gnajda was not clean?
is it just me or does that not add up?
gnajda wasn't innocent at all. even if he didn't cheat in these games (and i'm sure he did) then he still got cb-banned for cheating in the past already and he never served his time but came back with a different nick. even though it's hard to proove it, it doesn't matter since everyone - even mrozu - knows about it and knows that it's true.
XFIRE community forced clanbase to ban player... Right now it doesnt matter if he cheated or not... Dont u see danger of such thing?
Proofs pl0x?
if u dont understand it, go to polish school maybe u will lern something about morality
You just defended him. Stupid idiot.
like yoda your english is.
But besides that I agree with most of your points
If you'd be fair you'd have to replay every match gnajda has played in. This won't happen though.
I have to agree with you about that gnadja case ,since demos ain't good proof and CB should ban all obvious guys or not to ban anyone .It is just fun that "name/fame" mean so much ,even though gnadja cheated or not ,he had already bad reputation cause of Trivium team.
CB made right decision kicking FF out ,after they had ban gnadja ,but still it was odd desicion banning gnadja cause of demo and I think they should have lighten up a bit.
About that Poland lan thing , In my opinion these pole haters just "hate" polish guys without reason (yes , I have done it myself too),maybe they are a bit laggy ,but whine is useless ánd usually in matches you can't even normally speak with your opponent.
Like you said it is also weird that usually when known player comes back to scene other players don't dislike him as they do towards "unknown" players .It might be also about nation ,I am not really sure about it ,but sometimes it looks like so
I am not defending cheaters ,I just think that everybody should have same rules and ban times
i am sick of beeing asked "who are you" only because i own my enemy. 3/4 of these cases i never heard of them either. its just ETattitude and as long as this wont change no teams can rise and revive this game. a game where players only insult eachother and every god damn player thinks he just got owned by hackers beacuse he lost has no future. ETplayers are killing ET not the ones leaving or not playing it.
PS: If admins decide to ban someone they go along do it and u guys just stfu about it. If some imcompetent admin (like chosen) does random stuff all the time only because he cant take to be passed by players he dosnt know and teams he prefers are getting raped we have to stand up and get rid of these bacl sheep among the admins. dont make this too general. your post is generally saying: dont ban (at all).
This isn't an online community but a tribal asshat-culture where asocial and belittling behaviour is encouraged.
Then again, that's also the reason why I love crossfire so much. Got nothing to do for a few minutes? Surf to crossfire.nu and let the sardonic grinning begin. Then when your download has finished or your food is ready, close crossfire without remembering who flamed who and move on.
the public heroes didnt...
and they all served their ban
but you can say, no proof, no ban and obvious playing is not a proof... but where would that end?
in that special case of gnajda also his cheating history was a fact... he was too stupid to even think of hiding his hax... how could he be intelligent enough to become the new hero in the eurocup?
gaming isnt only aim!
http://www.team-coolermaster.co.uk/index.php?site=news_comments&newsID=438
So, if I play (any kind of CB official match) versus suspicious guys and later start conflict and submit demos to CB for checking them, afterwards admins really find in them obvious cheating moments - that makes me the bad guy who can force clanbase to think and react as only I want?
As already a lot of xfire users explained (and as you can see yourself) - they were playing on public server which is in no way related to OC/EC games. They got banned and it was forbidden for them to take a part in EC. They were not playing in EC. So they (perfo & blabla) couldn't cheat in EC matches. Gnajda as you know played. Playing & cheating in EC/OC/any other cup = changing the outcome of it.
Afterall, I think it's even good for the community can force CB to do something (not like banning for no reason (which is not in Gnajda's case) or "just because I lost to them") useful. Can you imagine - most of the community found Gnajda as too much suspicious and relatively new + not approved ar stable LAN player (with stable LAN I mean not only <some random tournament> in Poland, but with widely known everywhere and in every ET community. I think if I'd now defend good ol' friend Kurbads from Latvia and tell that "he was playing" in "Elik's pro championship ET LAN @ Riga" - noone would take it serious), they made avi's, recorded demos, done everything to open the eyes for those who were unsure wether he's hacking or not.
Besides - name me some good proving method that could be used for catching cheaters if not only demos?
PB screens? 90% of et hacks have that "clean-screen" feature or you could simply fake them (change your name, spoof guids and use freeware cheats on PB secured servers)
red yawns / PB kicking for violations? Please. You remember how nC kicked a lot of players using random PB exploits? Do you actually know that guidspoofing is easyer than opening a beer with one hand?
Can you explain for us the perfect method of catching cheaters? Waiting until himself comes up with "i'm sorry guys - i was cheating"? waiting until he uses something similiar to spinhack in CS (or what was that name of hack?) and in the same time automatically spam in game chat "IM USING THIS AND THAT CHEAT. YOU CAN GET IT THERE AND THERE!"?
Sorry for weak english - never was over low+ at it and besides it's already late. I hope you've got the point.
And yes, I find your column biased, created for defending Gnajda with weak arguments. Plus you're offending anyone else who's got different opinion. And I'm pretty sure I will get offended by you also.
Godnatt.
do u realise how much match conflicts trivium had? massive amount of demos where exchanged, and noone ever send them to cb... BUT after whine @ xf clanbase were forced to find some reason to ban gnajda...
somehow made me LoL irl XD
speaking about -=elik=-, afaik some really old pre-dinosaur RTCW NC/rtcw.no wars were played from there:D
finally we are getting some where getting these players away from serious competition. a year ago playing scrims was fun. sure you ended up with retards sometimes. but nowadays you can go 1 night without playing unfriendly, immature players or even worst obvious cheaters.
and sure its hard to get rid of them is scrims... but in competition we as a community have a responsabilaty to get rid of them. they put a tarnish on the reputation of our beloved game. why do you think its so little prizemoney in ET ? because there are so many cheaters.
I used to run home from uni to play ET, but Im getting fed up with the cheaters. and along comes ETACE and what do the community do? whine. instead of whining do something your self. start quitting games with obvious cheaters. I dont care if they have a clean yawn. we all know PB sux. ofc its clean. they bought a cheat that is guarantied to keep them from getting banned by PB...
So when you start getting those perfect nades in your face at od possitions, just leave. let them play amongst themselfs.
as for polish players being the most hated in the community, is it so hard to understand? most of their "god" players are obvious cheaters, some exceptions (kot imo). add to that a blatant disrespect for others. how many times have you been verbally bashed by a polish player??!! I once was told "your mother washes cloth in river!" I have no idea what they meant by it but I guess its some sort of insult in poland...
ofc they are hated. hell, I have a mirc script saying "polak warning" when any polish person starts a conversation with me, just to make it easy to disregard those players. I also serach "no polish or retards". that has given me some rather funny remarks in the past... like "are you racist?". sins when is polish a race? last time I looked they are caucasian like the rest of europe. but hey, in a way I can relate to it... in a personally perspective they are a people of their own...
I have met nice polish players also. dont get me wrong. but they seem to be the exception that confirms the rule.
just my 5 cents.
let the bashing begin...
so dont give me this crap about wrobel's cheating.
and polish dont deserve to be most hated... idd we got many teenage players who still need to grow up, but im sure u or your teammate said sth earier before phrase about your mother...
and this "no polish" is really annoying, and its very close to racism... nationalism its the word i belive
well if you are going to say something like that you should prolly add WHY they don't deserve it....
as for wrobel: are you serious? him and gnajda should make a movie... it would be called "this is how a cheater looks"....
you keep bashing players like mAus and butchij and keep defending all polish players that 99% of the nonpolish community can see are cheaters.
wanna know what is really killing this game ? cheaters like those. so here is my proposition, first go a englishcoarse. then go see an obstetrician about getting glasses. then after you grow some facialhair you can come back here and give us your opinions. now GTFO
accusing cpc player is the peak of stupidity...
and its not my problem that big part of scene has such big egos, seeing cheaters everywhere...
and good advice... chill out its only a game
btw. i assume u feel good when your country is being offended by some foreigners?