It’s the perpetual question – how to improve the perfect? How to strike that balance between tactical variation, class structure and the ‘feel’ of gameplay?
It’s a difficult question, one that’s puzzled map makers and admins alike for years. Restrict this, reintroduce that, keep this, change that. An endless task of reinventing, reworking and sometimes ruining the wheel.
But have they got the balance right? Is the over reliance on medics a burden or a virtue? Would this game be more rich, more dynamic, more tactically variant where we to level out the score, and improve the lesser used classes?
Possibly.
The covert ops class is currently redundant. It’s used occasionally and ineffectively to pester defenders on delivery, mindless frenzy attack on reactor or on battery, but beyond that, we’ve allowed this rich class to stagnate for years, allowed it to degenerate into an objective only class used reluctantly to destroy command posts and the like. Why is this? Why would we not want to reintroduce one of the more exciting aspects of our predecessor?
We’ve already the means to do this – all we need is the motivation.
The covert op class, and primarily the sniper, has several levels of upgrades available to us. They go from the benign to the revolutionary. These are (thanks to Xzz & joYnt):
Military Intelligence and Scoped Weapons Level 1: Improved Use of Scoped Weapon Ammunition
Each Ammo Pack you get from a Field Ops or Ammo Cabinet includes one extra clip of ammunition for your Scoped Weapon
Military Intelligence and Scoped Weapons Level 2: Improved use of Sabotage and Misdirection
Your expertise allows you to use your Satchel Charges and Smoke Grenades more often: your Power Bar usage will be reduced by 1/3rd.
Military Intelligence and Scoped Weapons Level 3: Breath Control
Your mastery of the Sniper's art results in a 50% reduction in both recoil jump and weapon sway with Scoped Weapons.
Locking the Covert Ops at level three by default could transform the class. In reducing the recoil and the weapon sway, you would immediately see an improvement in the effectiveness and use of the class. Snipers would be able to fire multiple, relatively accurate shots at their target not buoyed down by the destabilising weapon sway, or the massive recoil relative to the damage of each shot.
This would not increase the damage per shot, nor the rate of fire. The skill of the sniper would remain, simply nerfed somewhat.
This would give teams an extra bow in their string. An extra option to exploit, an extra variation to the game. It would enable teams to work on developing new tactics that could perhaps utilise the improved sniper class. In turn, this would force teams to evolve their counter-strategies in order to neutralise this pest.
Two simple cvars can achieve this:
The law of unintended consequences dictates that there’s a number of factors to tweaking the sniper, such as the required power bar to throw a satchel, or smoke grenade being reduced by 1/3. These are an irrelevance.
A new ClanBase season is approaching, I don’t doubt the config makers are hard at work. Is it time to once again reinvent the wheel?
It’s a difficult question, one that’s puzzled map makers and admins alike for years. Restrict this, reintroduce that, keep this, change that. An endless task of reinventing, reworking and sometimes ruining the wheel.
But have they got the balance right? Is the over reliance on medics a burden or a virtue? Would this game be more rich, more dynamic, more tactically variant where we to level out the score, and improve the lesser used classes?
Possibly.
The covert ops class is currently redundant. It’s used occasionally and ineffectively to pester defenders on delivery, mindless frenzy attack on reactor or on battery, but beyond that, we’ve allowed this rich class to stagnate for years, allowed it to degenerate into an objective only class used reluctantly to destroy command posts and the like. Why is this? Why would we not want to reintroduce one of the more exciting aspects of our predecessor?
We’ve already the means to do this – all we need is the motivation.
The covert op class, and primarily the sniper, has several levels of upgrades available to us. They go from the benign to the revolutionary. These are (thanks to Xzz & joYnt):
Military Intelligence and Scoped Weapons Level 1: Improved Use of Scoped Weapon Ammunition
Each Ammo Pack you get from a Field Ops or Ammo Cabinet includes one extra clip of ammunition for your Scoped Weapon
----
Military Intelligence and Scoped Weapons Level 2: Improved use of Sabotage and Misdirection
Your expertise allows you to use your Satchel Charges and Smoke Grenades more often: your Power Bar usage will be reduced by 1/3rd.
---
Military Intelligence and Scoped Weapons Level 3: Breath Control
Your mastery of the Sniper's art results in a 50% reduction in both recoil jump and weapon sway with Scoped Weapons.
Locking the Covert Ops at level three by default could transform the class. In reducing the recoil and the weapon sway, you would immediately see an improvement in the effectiveness and use of the class. Snipers would be able to fire multiple, relatively accurate shots at their target not buoyed down by the destabilising weapon sway, or the massive recoil relative to the damage of each shot.
This would not increase the damage per shot, nor the rate of fire. The skill of the sniper would remain, simply nerfed somewhat.
This would give teams an extra bow in their string. An extra option to exploit, an extra variation to the game. It would enable teams to work on developing new tactics that could perhaps utilise the improved sniper class. In turn, this would force teams to evolve their counter-strategies in order to neutralise this pest.
Two simple cvars can achieve this:
The law of unintended consequences dictates that there’s a number of factors to tweaking the sniper, such as the required power bar to throw a satchel, or smoke grenade being reduced by 1/3. These are an irrelevance.
A new ClanBase season is approaching, I don’t doubt the config makers are hard at work. Is it time to once again reinvent the wheel?
E: Would like to see XP save back to level 2 for all classes though (or something along the lines of that), but meh, you can't have it all. And to be honest, this idea actually looks intriguing :)
You able to fix the column image? Can't fixy from here =[
Anyway, I am from the unpatched ET, so some piece of me still loves XP saves :P I think it would be nice to include some more of it. But like I said, you can't have it all. I do think that this Covert idea is really nice though, seeing as it could add another dimension to the game and get that class used more, like you said (this opinion is also influenced by the fact that I have 2 Finnish Script Snipers in my clan though)
But this doesn't need buffing. Sniping is already overpowered. Include 71fps and sensitivity toggles into the equation and you may aswell just make no recoil scripts legal.
It's hardly an irrelevance when shitmaps like reactor are thrown in to mappools.
Whoever made NC mappoll is a fucking retard. I bet it seemed like a fun idea to throw in maps like reactor. Fuck, I would LOVE to play braundorf, frostbite or adlernest instead of that piece of shit, abortion of a map.
Wanted new fresh maps? Delivery is not enought? Bremen is not too good? FUCK YEAH, lets add reactor and throw in battery for funnies (that I can forgive).
FUCK YOU CLOWNNBASE
on topic, no thank you, everyone can snipe without recoil n shit now
reactor is, was, and will be failure of a map, it was played years ago in quakecon, nations cup, and some cups, NEW map right? it was abandoned for a reason (it beeing SHIT if you don't follow)
if you want new maps so bad, join fucking public server and enjoy, there is no place in competition for maps like reactor
why do you think there is no place for maps like radar? radar is nice map tbh
lets choose 3 maps (2 for normal gaming, 1 for probable decider) and play just them, isnt it good idea? o_O
imo if reactor have some changes, it would be awesome map, as it ever was..
Clearly you haven't played delivery. Some people play 2 sniper attacks and it's already overpowered as fuck. People snipe/sten occasionally on radar too.
Just because something is there doesn't mean we need to use it. With that logic, we should bring back mortar.
And for the Covert Ops part:
Yes, I do know the Delivery thing. My opinion just is that the class doesn't seem to be useful enough in comparison to the other classes. I mean, you only use it sometimes on attack (like 1st stage delivery and rare occasions on Radar) but I usually don't see teams dropping a medic spot for a covert, especially not on defence. And it is this kind of idea that could change that.
EDIT: DONT FORGET HE IS IN THE EC!
I beg to differ, it's very effective, and not really occasionally, more like in every single match
i think currently the use of a sniper in et is just about right.
just..imo sten should be used more
All of these change the game - not necessarily too much for the worse, if you actually think about it. The tactical change inherant in reinstating light weaps 3 and fops 1 is massive - but basically the opposite of your stated (or at least implied) objective of nerfing the medic. It's these XP levels (well, and medic 1 for the extra clip there) that made the original Dignitas so devastating with 5 medics and 1 fops tactics.
There's no stated or implied intention to nerf the medic (to me nerf implies actual change to the class, which this wouldn't) - the only 'nerf' relating to the medic would be to suggest players have the option to change the makeup of their team. Choice is good, no?
Prior my time involved with, though I strongly doubt there was ever any discussion as to the impact on this class in particular when those initial decisions where made.
My comments weren't intended to show yours up as ludicrous (although my phrasing in this regard could've been better, I admit). I actually think the suggestions I made are reasonable ones, if you wished to change the game in that way. They wouldn't break things in the way that high level fops and medic did, and the increase in ammo availability might reduce the prevalence of push-selfkill defences (it would certainly favour attackers more against such defences).
no snipers ffs!
i really hate them, especially in a 1on1 :|
that "push" pisses me off! same goes for the rifles
And I (this is personal) really don't feel the need for more snipers
Learn how decisions are made ^_^
e: looking at your ideas about sniper, you should consider becoming a CB admin
Which part do you disagree with? Where have CB gone wrong? What would you do better? How would skilled players make better decisions? Are skilled players unanimous in their support of certain settings, or the map list?
where CB has gone wrong? are you seriously asking me this? won't even bother going into this.
A proper skilled played would go ask other teams what they think about the changes that may occur and he knows probably 10x more how the game should be played than same random person who pubs ones a while.
The latter thing, you seriously think players aren't talked to? Can't think of one 'big' decision I've been involved with that hasn't. There's no necessity to play at the highest level to facilitate this, nor play at all. I think the various one day cup admins competing in their own tournaments is proof enough that this can be more of a negative than a positive.
You've an issue with bad admins, bad 'skilled' admins are still bad.
re CB, see my previous point. Playing on a high level is irrelevant, none of the 'great' admins did.
The level 1 thing would be welcome however, not a radical change in any way but at least it balances the least used class. (btw it also gives you +1 clips to initial ammunition and max capacity)
Imho it wouldnt make much of a difference as the problem with snipers in ET is that they cant shoot when getting hit. Even with lvl 3 spread it you wouldnt be able to take down a guy, who can hit at least one bullet.
However, once engaged, the sniper is useless due to the ridiculous knockback on scope.
At what they do, they could be considered overpowered, but what they do is relatively useless other than in very few certain situations.
reason people dont use snipers, theyre freaking useless because:
Why do you want to change the game all the, if Wolf: ET is crappy just wait another one ! Don't forget that Splashdamage was behind this game, they only want to do pubgames. They have made a RtCW4Noob, if you don't like it, try RtCW !
In RtCW no one wanted any changes like this.
what about nerfing the medic class? just make that they cannot pickup the enemy's gun! :~D
the medic is kinda superior to the other classes. usually they run out of ammuntion so they get vulnerable but still they can grab the gun on the floor and continue fragging.
by the way it was just a thought that came up, so dont be hating!
edit: this also could bring back some lovely fieldops action
atleast recognize the superiority of medics...
e: and yes ofc the ability to give yourself medipacks @ camp position :P
try to combine 140HP and HP regeneration with ammuntion(by picking up the enemy's weapon not by an own fieldops).
example of the "mirror match"
medic kills eng -> picks up gun -> heal.
medic kills eng again -> picks up gun again -> heal.
continue this by your own
medic kills eng -> heal.
medic kills eng again -> heal.
now there´s a possible chance that the medic runs out of ammuntion and has to use pistol only. which makes him weaker and could end up being killed.
in addition there´s always of course the chance being killed by eng first.
you could of coure also change the max HP
-> 3hs = Kill
or just something like that :o)
all these ideas are included in the fabolous RtCW! :)
Other thing I never get, in Wolf: ET you can stand up and shot all your ammos at 200 meters without losing a big accuracy, to me it made a game boring.
but still ET != RtCW :<
So no, no change needed.
ps: I played RtCW since 2k1.. :x
btw watch this:
Bodyshot: 34 HP (50 HP in sniper mode)
Headshot with helmet: 48 HP (80 HP in sniper mode)
Headshot without helmet: 68 HP (100 HP in sniper mode)
sometimes its dose but not always
ET sniper = easier to use
RtCW sniper = harder to use but hs = kill
Do you see now ?
i achieve this with etbot np
add nade hitsounds and arty hitsounds
Just reduce the initial HP of the medic class and the game will be more interesting.
and like vanhaomena sayed level 3 would make it too easy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Script_kiddie
Soldier
Medic
Engineer
Field Ops
Covert Ops
maybe i'd make it 1hs = kill and a bit higher body shots damage (4 hits for a medic who is throwing packs is a bit too much)
or
BUFF THE MEDICSES AND NERF THE RIFLERS
or
BUFF THE MEDICSES AND NERF THE SNIPERS
It's worth testing IMO.