clickEarlier this week Fox News reported that the IHH has links to terrorist groups including Hamas and Al Qaeda. Indeed, the IHH was described in federal court documents as playing a role in the Millennium terrorist plot to bomb Los Angeles International Airport.
The Turkish charity was described in a recent report as being a "radical Islamic organization with an anti-Western orientation," and that "besides its legitimate philanthropic activities, it supports radical Islamic networks, including Hamas, and that at least in the past, even global jihad networks." (See full report below)
Anne Bayefsky, a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute and Touro College, and an active participant in the U.N.'s NGO system, tells Fox News that the status granted to IHH gives most NGOs access to U.N. diplomats and enables them to speak at sessions of a number of U.N. bodies that are streamed online around the world and translated into six languages.
Their consultative status also allows groups to distribute their material or statements as U.N. documents, Bayefsky said, "which gives them permanence and widespread circulation."
Bayefsky says that the difficulty in joining the NGO committee often depends on the organization and the groups it seeks to protect. While "serious" human rights organizations are often blocked from gaining membership, she said, "applications from NGOs from or aligned with non-democratic states sail through without objection."
While the IHH denies it supports terrorism, one of its members, Oguzan Ulas, told Fox News that Israel is trying to smear the organization. He did however say that the IHH does support Hamas and said that his organization disagreed with Hamas being designated a terrorist group by the U.S.
A U.S. State Department spokesman told Fox News that the IHH has not been designated as a Foreign Terrorist Organization, and added, "We are unable to comment on the internal process with respect to specific designations."
But he made it clear where the U.S. stood on fighting terrorism: "We are fully committed to taking appropriate action against foreign groups engaging in terrorist activity in order to prevent such groups from obtaining the resources and support needed to undertake terrorist activity."
Asked whether the United Nations should take any action against the IHH, a spokeswoman for the Office of the Under-Secretary-General for the U.N. Department of Economic and Social Affairs would only confirm that the IHH does indeed enjoy consultative status within the U.N.'s NGO system.
Yet this is not the first time the U.N's NGO system has accepted groups with terrorist links. In 2006 and 2007, Fox News exposed a Saudi-based charity called the International Islamic Relief Organization (IIRO), which, despite having two of its branches in the Philippines and Indonesia on the U.S. and U.N. terror list for aiding Al Qaeda, still enjoys full NGO status. Despite calls from members of Congress to expel them, the U.N. remains silent.
nerds getting rolled @ europe
ROFL @ record, piece of shits, i hope they will die
You took over a country thats not even yours(cuz at the end u just took over tbh) then you started doing stuff which reminds lots to the apartheid in southafrica.
hey my brainwashed friend is back :)))) do you still not believe law?????????? do all we do false?????????/ whyz m8 plz help me understand :)) thats what friends do
Oh dear, playing the victim card? What's next? Do you want financial compensation because some1 made an attempt to give some food and goods to the palestinians? Maybe some of you lack common sense... You don't kill 9 innocent people in international waters for no reason whatsoever. And don't tell me they were supplying weapons or you make a fool of yourself.
Did you even see the pic of the 'weapons' they showed? Haha, sticks, some kitchen knives, hammers,... (no guns!!) Yea never seen that before, kitchen knives in a ship. They even put some headscarves on the pic. Haha, yea that's very dangerous or was it an attempt to make them look like terrorists? There were even cd's on the pic. Yea, that must be very deadly... Imagine some ninja that cut off your head with a cd...
The pic you posted is correct but if you read a,c & e again the israel had NO right to act like this.
if they wanted to supply the food and goods to gaza, why didnt they agree to israel offer to stop at ashdod port and the goods will be moved from there to gaza
how come the ship were escorted by 6 more vessels and all of them were taken over by commando unit and that ship was the only who did problems
gas masks, bullet proof vests, thats all you need
beside, why no one said anything when usa blockade cuba or do you know that egypt have the same blockadge on gaza just like israel?
rules are rules, and everything was just like the book
Like any1 trusts Israel?
Well it says more about Israeli's special forces that fucked up than about the people on that vessel. It's more then understandable if your vessel get attacked by commando units that you take everything you can to defend yourself (sticks, knives). If Israeli commando's were not such an amateurs nothing would have happened. It's still guns vs sticks/knives. Some common sense would be good.
Not really. The ship was still almost 100 miles off the zone. No reason whatsoever for Israel to act like this.
they infact resisted capture, and ignored warnings given by the israeli navy, so IDF had the rights to attack the activist, and let's not mention DEFEND THEIR OWN BODY, when clearly in the videos you see them brutally attacking the soldiers coming out with paintballs (capturing / attacking wasn't israels intention at all)
you are seriously arguing on something too obvious
Oh yea saw those video's. What a joke. There was nothing on it. Pure propaganda like we're used to. Reminds me about the American 'evidence' to invade Iraq.
Commando units vs some activists. Quite logical that commando units are by far better armed. If they wouldn't have fucked up like a bunch of amateurs no1 would have been killed.
Why have we only seen the first 20 seconds of the raid and not the rest of the videos where Israeli troops massacred people? I doubt the camera men stopped rolling?
Propaganda is propaganda... there was a good piece the other day on how your PR machine is actually harming your military :O) look at all the recent fucks up - then listen to the Israeli media machine on how they were all successes right?
British gunships routinely board ships in the Caribbean to inspect for drugs - when was the last time the British military caused a massacre whilst boarding a ship? And these are usually armed people carrying a large drugs cargo with plenty reason to fight back.
How can you paint this as anything other than a complete and absolute catastrophe - both militarily and pr?
it's funny you give me a random site and calls IDF propaganda, i can do the same...don't you see we are trapped? there is no source that can be believed as genuine
plus it's kinda funny you compare a capture with none resistance and a capture with resistance that had no rights (according to every law ever excisted)
It's not a random site, it links directly to 2 videos on the IDF youtube page. One the original & one the doctored.
You've still not answered my question - given ships are routinely boarded around the globe do you not accept that this was absolutely a military failure? And secondly given that even the US has come out & said the blockade of Gaza is untenable is this anything other than a pr disaster?
the military failed misserably in this actions
the ship did not contain peace acticists (at least not all the 600) and it's not a fucking propaganda
i don't believe in anything my media gives but niether do the anti- israeli international bullshit that gives false information (i'm amazed at the knowledge people have here in cf and it's only ur shit news to blame)
end of story
to ur US comment - they as well confirmed we had our rights to intercept
Right if you say so :O) how many were not peace activists & then what are they?
When your government is so patently peddling lies (as the above link shows) why on earth would you continue to support their actions? And why on earth would you believe a word that's said?
Please do point out one example where I've been mis-informed so far.
"What kind of hyperbole is this headline. 9 people were hit with at total of 30 bullets, not shot 30 times"
won't say it's true, but shows that your shit site might also be a little bit corrupted than you think
Here is me killing your "conversation is fake" propaganda
yet again I prove you that YOU are the one reading propaganda, that we have to face lies told by anti Israelis, and that Europe just won't accept the truth
yes, some people here are seriously damaged when it's about army, and no, since those motherfuckers were piece of shits (see rachel corrie capture for an normal peace activists)
whats with the hate? you can't face the truth so you start with blaming us on everything now?
for a change, our explanation system has woke up, maybe later they will bother to even explain to you imbeciles that can't accept anything how gaza really works and who's to blame
one day it will happen, untill then we will suffer your hypocrite shit
what do you think happened? IDF saw the ships, attacked them, the activists defended themselves from the IDF shooting them? please tell me it's what you think
Israeli's position relies on its ability to defend two assertions: that the naval blockade of Gaza is legal and that the ships contained passengers who were attempting to support Hamas, thus the boarding of the ships was justifiable in the context of the first assertion. As a result, Israel justifies their naval blockage of Gaza by citing an equivalent naval blockade of North Korea, and suggests that the ships passengers were attempting to support Hamas because of the behaviour of the ships passengers, who were 'energetically beating and stabbing the troops sent to board their ship' (The Jerusalem Post).
However, the justification of a Gaza naval blockage through an analogy to North Korea is unsustainable, because Gaza does not spend 16% of its national GDP on the military and does not possess nuclear weapons like North Korea, a single-party state. If Israel justifies their naval blockade by using North Korea, then they should be able to prove that Gaza (Hamas) is as threatening to the world as North Korea. As a result, my inclination is to suggest that the naval blockade is in fact illegal. In addition, the justification that the ships passengers were supporting Hamas because of their behaviour is problematic for a number of reasons: one, Raphael Schutz (Israeli ambassador to Spain), pointed out that 'we have never said that this flotilla was transporting arms for the Hamas terrorists', which begs the question why the IDF attempted to board the ship in the first place; two, a captain of the IDF who was part of the operation admitted that the passengers obtained weapons from the IDF who boarded the ship, and a separate IDF spokesman said that passengers threw these overboard; and three, the suggestion that the behaviour of passengers suggests an ideological and political link to Hamas or Islamic fundamentalism as the Israeli secratory of state suggested is logically unsustainable. Take The Jerusalem Post's outline of the events:
'It is a testament to the training and resourcefulness of those two-dozen soldiers that, undermanned, armed primarily with paint-ball guns and caught by complete surprise, they managed to take control of the situation away from the crowbar-wielding mobs without losing even one of their own, even if five required surgery'.
How could the IDF have been undermanned and 'caught by complete surprise' when they boarded the ships? In addition, the suggestion that the IDF was armed primarily with paint-ball guns and managed to 'take control of the situation away from the crowbar-wielding mobs without losing even one of their own' is a lie. Consider the casualties:
Cengiz Alquyz, 42 (Four gunshot wounds: back of head, right side of face, back, left leg)
Ibrahim Bilgen, 60 (Four gunshot wounds: right chest, back, right hip, right temple)
Cegdet Kiliclar, 38 (One gunshot wound: middle of forehead)
Furkan Dogan, 19 (Five gunshot wounds: nose, back, back of head, left leg, left ankle)
Sahri Yaldiz (Four gunshot wounds: left chest, left leg, right leg twice)
Aliheyder Bengi, 39 (Six gunshot wounds: left chest, belly, right arm, right leg, left hand twice)
Cetin Topcuoglu, 54 (Three gunshot wounds: back of head, left side, right belly)
Cengiz Songur, 47 (One gunshot wound: front of neck)
Necdet Yildirim, 32 (Two gunshot wounds: right shoulder, left back)
I am struggling to see the 'resourcefulness of those two-dozen soldiers' who took 'control of the situation away from the crowbar-wielding mobs' by shooting middle-aged men in the head repeatedly; if the protesters had weapons it was those they captured from the Israeli's who boarded the ship as your own personal suggested.
Nevertheless, if Israel is unable to accept its mistakes, including the fact it its own sources contradict one another, then it can always fail back on its tried and trusted arguments: biased journalism; and my personal favourite, the argument that 'Turks, Swedes, Britons and even Americans are not Israeli, […] living with the daily knowledge that Hamas is an enemy seeking their eradication', and 'their memory [of the region] is short and their moral calculus simple'. Yes, because the American and British have no experience in the middle east and have a simple moral compass when it comes to terrorists!
many say that the blockadge is illigal, so i want to ask you why you are not saying the same to egypt who have the SAME blockadge over gaza?
the blockadge is only to stop millitary equipments, period
food, water, electricity, oil and other matarials are going daily from israel to gaza
the "peaceful ships" were asked to port at ashdod so they could unpack the goods there and israel will move it to gaza
when they refused, they broke the international law
now we go to phase two
military operation
now for some men resources, there were few units who go on those ships, matzesa unit who specialize in non lethal force weapon (they train many units across europe, escpially units who serve in jails, where you need non lethal force) and the main unit who took part are the navy seals
the navy seals board with non lethal weapons such as the FN paint ball and regular paint balls gun like you play in your favourit paint ball park
along with those, they have their personal side arm on their legs
intel said the boat are filled with peaceful men (guess WHY)
your only question of how middle aged men got shot in the head
well i can give you another question
why a dog lick his balls?
answer: HE CAN
navy seals who are well trained, seeing their friends get stabbed by a mob who wear bullet proof vests, and stealing their friends side arms will get shot in the head
no question there
and im still amazed by you europeans thinking the blockadge is not justify
but hey, egypt have the same blockadge, lets ram israel !
The reason no one has mentioned Egypt is because Egypt has not boarded a ship and ruthlessly killed protesters, that is why; I would say that Egypt's blockade is probably illegal too, but I have not looked into too much to be honest. Nevertheless, the ships did not break international law by refusing to dock at Ashdod; the only circumstance in which the ship would have broken international law was if the passengers were proven to have intended to support Hamas or, as you put it, supply them with 'military equipment'. However, as I clearly stated in my previous post, the IDF found no military equipment on-board, and have admitted that the weapons the passengers had were taken from IDF soldiers boarding the ship.
With regards to the type of Israeli personal boarding the ship, that is of no consequence; the Israeli armed-forces cannot justify later actions because of their poor planning. Your suggestion that Israeli armed-forces were justified in shooting multinational civilians in the head (repeatedly) in international waters shows you are not interested in resolving the issue; one, the IDF should never have boarded the ship because they are far more effective ways to maintain a naval blockade—Israel should deployed warships, and then stopped and searched ships entering Gaza; two, the IDF should never have boarded the ship because they could not prove its passengers were guilty without endangering Israel's own political position—that is, Israel attempts to justifies its action after finding evidence on-board the ship, which they have failed to do; and three, if the IDF has to board a ship they do not do it in the middle of the night, instilling a siege mentality in the passengers, who can wear whatever they want to be honest (you are going to get laughed out of court if you suggest they were supporting Hamas because they wearing bullet-proof vests and hitting Israeli soldiers with bars, knifes and sticks), and they should have either used plastic bullets and shot below the waist.
yea egypt did not kill any one lol
as a soldier in the idf who was stationed in egypt-israel boarder, you have no idea how much they kill rape and sometimes not in the same order, refugees from sudan
we film these all the time and send it to the UN but nothing happen and its like that for years
the killing of the protesters (you cant seriously calling ppl who want to be shaidz and breaking the law and attacking soldiers protesters never the less peace protesters but ok what ever)
it was jestify
the blockade is legal you can check it what ever
and yes they did break the international law by trying to break the blockade and thats the main point of the argument
no weapons were found?
the idf state that they found weapons and found evidence of "hot weapons"
oh but wait you prolly right man
the poor ppl of gaza are so hungry they gonna eat a nice meal of bullet proof vest and for disert some nice camo suits :XD
for the rest of your planning all i could say
i salut you general armchair !!!
the planes you gave here, i will email them to the prime minister for further operations
the mission was suppose to be simple
board the peaceful ship with peaceful protesters
and navigate it to port
the angry mob of shaidz and criminals/terrorists cause what happened next
and when a commando soldier with a side arm is getting lynched by 12 ppl around him who run with knifes and metal pole in order to kill him
you srsly surprise why ppl got shot in the head from close range? :XD
the boarding on the ships in international water was jestify since they got warnings not to break the blockade
You are not addressing the issues I raised. I said 'Egypt has not boarded a ship and ruthlessly killed [multinational] protesters', and you completely ignored this point and talked about something else that is only indirectly related; as an aside, what you pointed out with regards to Egypt mistreating the Sudanese is a legitimate issue across all conflict zones that needs addressed; the fact Pakistan is the largest troop contributor the UN says enough about the problem, though.
Again, you are not addressing the issues I raised. You repeat that the naval blockade is legal but do not justify why it is legal, and you ignore the suggestions I raised and use irrelevant evidence (Egypt) to support your conclusion (that the troops were justified in killing the protesters) rather than your argument (that the naval blockade was legal, thus the boarding of the ship was legal).
Do you not see how repetitive your argument is? '[Y]es they did break the international law by trying to break the blockade and thats the main point of the argument'.'[T]he boarding on the ships in international water was [justified] since they got warnings not to break the blockade'. Do you not realise you are not proving anything; you are not proving why the blockade is legal? I will repeat: there is only one way Israel can justify boarding the ship, and that is to prove that the passengers on-board the ship were aiming to support Hamas. IDF sources have said the weapons the passengers used were obtained from Israeli soldiers boarding the ship, some of which was throw immediately overboard, yet you justify the action taken, calling the passengers an 'angry mob of shaidz and criminals/terrorists'. If, as you suggest, the IDF found evidence of hot weapons—they haven't and they and other Israeli sources have admitted that they have not found any hot weapons—then why did the IDF not suffer one single casualty? Seriously, think about it. Despite being armed with hot weapons and mobbing the Israeli soldiers, the IDF did not suffer one single casualty. Why you fail to consider the likelihood that the passengers did not in fact have any hot weapons is beyond me; a complete failure of imagination as far as I am concerned.
it will guid you step by step why everything was legit
you keep saying that the protestors otbained the guns from the commandos so what evidance you have that it was not the protestors who shot their own friends in the head in order to blame israel?
the improvised weapons the protestors had needed a long time to make and prepare
which shows you what were their intentions
how come out of six peace ships (some time ago the rachel cory or what ever its name was also took over by israeli commandos) only the marmara was causing problems?
i have proven you again and again why everything was legit but you keep saying that in order to board the ship there should be intent to support hamas with weapons and thats NOT TRUE
IN ORDER TO BOARD THE SHIP, THE SHIP SHOULD ONLY BREAK THE BLOCKADE
but never the less, the marmara DID have army metirials such as bullet proof vest and camo suits
the website i gave you will answer why the blockade is legal and justify
"I will repeat: there is only one way Israel can justify boarding the ship, and that is to prove that the passengers on-board the ship were aiming to support Hamas. IDF sources have said the weapons the passengers used were obtained from Israeli soldiers boarding the ship, some of which was throw immediately overboard"
again you are wrong
israel can board the ship if they are trying to break its blockade and ignore the warnings
the ship was searched for weapons by the government it was sailed from
from there the protestors used tools and made WEAPONS (if i kill someone with a stick i will be charged for killing with a lethal weapon)
their intents were clear along with the videos of the passangers claiming that they want to be shaidz
the israeli media show pictures of bullet proofs vests and rifle scopes and gas masks AND NIGHT VISION GOOGLES
do you understand that night vision googles consider as killing weapon ? http://www.inn.co.il/News/News.aspx/205114
there goes your point that israeli media did not report of such things
do you even saw israeli media reports?
because in all of them you see these weapons
I just noticed that I posted my original comment twice; the website crashed last night and I did not know the first comment had been posted, apologises! Hopefully I will have addressed all of your comments in the post above.
Do exam, revise. Revise. Revise. Exam + Revise. Exam and get battered after.
I will - as recreation - play some wars and poker on unibet
Good luck with your exams.
The Turkish charity was described in a recent report as being a "radical Islamic organization with an anti-Western orientation," and that "besides its legitimate philanthropic activities, it supports radical Islamic networks, including Hamas, and that at least in the past, even global jihad networks." (See full report below)
Anne Bayefsky, a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute and Touro College, and an active participant in the U.N.'s NGO system, tells Fox News that the status granted to IHH gives most NGOs access to U.N. diplomats and enables them to speak at sessions of a number of U.N. bodies that are streamed online around the world and translated into six languages.
Their consultative status also allows groups to distribute their material or statements as U.N. documents, Bayefsky said, "which gives them permanence and widespread circulation."
Bayefsky says that the difficulty in joining the NGO committee often depends on the organization and the groups it seeks to protect. While "serious" human rights organizations are often blocked from gaining membership, she said, "applications from NGOs from or aligned with non-democratic states sail through without objection."
While the IHH denies it supports terrorism, one of its members, Oguzan Ulas, told Fox News that Israel is trying to smear the organization. He did however say that the IHH does support Hamas and said that his organization disagreed with Hamas being designated a terrorist group by the U.S.
A U.S. State Department spokesman told Fox News that the IHH has not been designated as a Foreign Terrorist Organization, and added, "We are unable to comment on the internal process with respect to specific designations."
But he made it clear where the U.S. stood on fighting terrorism: "We are fully committed to taking appropriate action against foreign groups engaging in terrorist activity in order to prevent such groups from obtaining the resources and support needed to undertake terrorist activity."
Asked whether the United Nations should take any action against the IHH, a spokeswoman for the Office of the Under-Secretary-General for the U.N. Department of Economic and Social Affairs would only confirm that the IHH does indeed enjoy consultative status within the U.N.'s NGO system.
Yet this is not the first time the U.N's NGO system has accepted groups with terrorist links. In 2006 and 2007, Fox News exposed a Saudi-based charity called the International Islamic Relief Organization (IIRO), which, despite having two of its branches in the Philippines and Indonesia on the U.S. and U.N. terror list for aiding Al Qaeda, still enjoys full NGO status. Despite calls from members of Congress to expel them, the U.N. remains silent.
nerds getting rolled @ europe
ROFL @ record, piece of shits, i hope they will die
ma ata mitragesh
kol yom ze aoto sipur : D
http://www.fresh.co.il/vBulletin/showpost.php?p=3728936&postcount=58
read (e) and (f)
AND
breaking a blockadge which they had
maybe the pickachu:PPP he dangerous:PP
http://mondoweiss.net/2010/06/mystery-solved-flotilla-cargo-contents-revealed.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16sANhzjcC0
Please dont kill me
you living in mad max world?
what about the yona bomber :DA:SD:A:S:DA:SD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3L7OV414Kk
and anyway all this terrorism goin on there its your own fault u do know that right?
just normal ppl with gas masks and bullet proof vests, using knifes and pikachu dull trying to break a blockadge and breaking international law
also they wanted to be shaidz
NORMAL PPL
stop being a 2nd southafrica
read the israeli nuclear doctorine : D
Who do they pay to make that shit up?
realy that hard?
Did you even see the pic of the 'weapons' they showed? Haha, sticks, some kitchen knives, hammers,... (no guns!!) Yea never seen that before, kitchen knives in a ship. They even put some headscarves on the pic. Haha, yea that's very dangerous or was it an attempt to make them look like terrorists? There were even cd's on the pic. Yea, that must be very deadly... Imagine some ninja that cut off your head with a cd...
The pic you posted is correct but if you read a,c & e again the israel had NO right to act like this.
how come the ship were escorted by 6 more vessels and all of them were taken over by commando unit and that ship was the only who did problems
gas masks, bullet proof vests, thats all you need
beside, why no one said anything when usa blockade cuba or do you know that egypt have the same blockadge on gaza just like israel?
rules are rules, and everything was just like the book
Well it says more about Israeli's special forces that fucked up than about the people on that vessel. It's more then understandable if your vessel get attacked by commando units that you take everything you can to defend yourself (sticks, knives). If Israeli commando's were not such an amateurs nothing would have happened. It's still guns vs sticks/knives. Some common sense would be good.
Not really. The ship was still almost 100 miles off the zone. No reason whatsoever for Israel to act like this.
you are seriously arguing on something too obvious
Commando units vs some activists. Quite logical that commando units are by far better armed. If they wouldn't have fucked up like a bunch of amateurs no1 would have been killed.
Propaganda is propaganda... there was a good piece the other day on how your PR machine is actually harming your military :O) look at all the recent fucks up - then listen to the Israeli media machine on how they were all successes right?
hehe
How can you paint this as anything other than a complete and absolute catastrophe - both militarily and pr?
Also http://maxblumenthal.com/2010/06/idf-releases-apparently-doctored-audio-press-reports-as-fact/
You're on the internet - there's so many sources of information out there. Why do you believe unquestionably?
plus it's kinda funny you compare a capture with none resistance and a capture with resistance that had no rights (according to every law ever excisted)
You've still not answered my question - given ships are routinely boarded around the globe do you not accept that this was absolutely a military failure? And secondly given that even the US has come out & said the blockade of Gaza is untenable is this anything other than a pr disaster?
Inept is the only word.
Edit: same story but from a 'less random' site - a very respected US foreign affairs blogger http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/2010/06/max_blumenthal/
the ship did not contain peace acticists (at least not all the 600) and it's not a fucking propaganda
i don't believe in anything my media gives but niether do the anti- israeli international bullshit that gives false information (i'm amazed at the knowledge people have here in cf and it's only ur shit news to blame)
end of story
to ur US comment - they as well confirmed we had our rights to intercept
When your government is so patently peddling lies (as the above link shows) why on earth would you continue to support their actions? And why on earth would you believe a word that's said?
Please do point out one example where I've been mis-informed so far.
This yet more anti-Israeli bullshit? http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6536MF20100604
won't say it's true, but shows that your shit site might also be a little bit corrupted than you think
i quite like this site, thanks mate, maybe if you'd bother reading some truth besides the false headlines you would open ur mind
Here is me killing your "conversation is fake" propaganda
yet again I prove you that YOU are the one reading propaganda, that we have to face lies told by anti Israelis, and that Europe just won't accept the truth
http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/2010/06/why_did_they_sh/
http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/2010/06/violence_hubris/ - Israelis celebrate the killings
i'm not one of them
http://www.mag.idf.il/592-4071-en/patzar.aspx
for a change, our explanation system has woke up, maybe later they will bother to even explain to you imbeciles that can't accept anything how gaza really works and who's to blame
one day it will happen, untill then we will suffer your hypocrite shit
a man who is charging at me with a bullet proof vest and a knife in order to stab me, will get a bullet to the head
they are not innocent since they broke the law
everything in this operation was legit
stop denying it
and wtf are you talking about, read the entire law and the San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994
but you know what
no one give a shit
they just won't get it :P
However, the justification of a Gaza naval blockage through an analogy to North Korea is unsustainable, because Gaza does not spend 16% of its national GDP on the military and does not possess nuclear weapons like North Korea, a single-party state. If Israel justifies their naval blockade by using North Korea, then they should be able to prove that Gaza (Hamas) is as threatening to the world as North Korea. As a result, my inclination is to suggest that the naval blockade is in fact illegal. In addition, the justification that the ships passengers were supporting Hamas because of their behaviour is problematic for a number of reasons: one, Raphael Schutz (Israeli ambassador to Spain), pointed out that 'we have never said that this flotilla was transporting arms for the Hamas terrorists', which begs the question why the IDF attempted to board the ship in the first place; two, a captain of the IDF who was part of the operation admitted that the passengers obtained weapons from the IDF who boarded the ship, and a separate IDF spokesman said that passengers threw these overboard; and three, the suggestion that the behaviour of passengers suggests an ideological and political link to Hamas or Islamic fundamentalism as the Israeli secratory of state suggested is logically unsustainable. Take The Jerusalem Post's outline of the events:
'It is a testament to the training and resourcefulness of those two-dozen soldiers that, undermanned, armed primarily with paint-ball guns and caught by complete surprise, they managed to take control of the situation away from the crowbar-wielding mobs without losing even one of their own, even if five required surgery'.
How could the IDF have been undermanned and 'caught by complete surprise' when they boarded the ships? In addition, the suggestion that the IDF was armed primarily with paint-ball guns and managed to 'take control of the situation away from the crowbar-wielding mobs without losing even one of their own' is a lie. Consider the casualties:
Cengiz Alquyz, 42 (Four gunshot wounds: back of head, right side of face, back, left leg)
Ibrahim Bilgen, 60 (Four gunshot wounds: right chest, back, right hip, right temple)
Cegdet Kiliclar, 38 (One gunshot wound: middle of forehead)
Furkan Dogan, 19 (Five gunshot wounds: nose, back, back of head, left leg, left ankle)
Sahri Yaldiz (Four gunshot wounds: left chest, left leg, right leg twice)
Aliheyder Bengi, 39 (Six gunshot wounds: left chest, belly, right arm, right leg, left hand twice)
Cetin Topcuoglu, 54 (Three gunshot wounds: back of head, left side, right belly)
Cengiz Songur, 47 (One gunshot wound: front of neck)
Necdet Yildirim, 32 (Two gunshot wounds: right shoulder, left back)
I am struggling to see the 'resourcefulness of those two-dozen soldiers' who took 'control of the situation away from the crowbar-wielding mobs' by shooting middle-aged men in the head repeatedly; if the protesters had weapons it was those they captured from the Israeli's who boarded the ship as your own personal suggested.
Nevertheless, if Israel is unable to accept its mistakes, including the fact it its own sources contradict one another, then it can always fail back on its tried and trusted arguments: biased journalism; and my personal favourite, the argument that 'Turks, Swedes, Britons and even Americans are not Israeli, […] living with the daily knowledge that Hamas is an enemy seeking their eradication', and 'their memory [of the region] is short and their moral calculus simple'. Yes, because the American and British have no experience in the middle east and have a simple moral compass when it comes to terrorists!
the blockadge is only to stop millitary equipments, period
food, water, electricity, oil and other matarials are going daily from israel to gaza
the "peaceful ships" were asked to port at ashdod so they could unpack the goods there and israel will move it to gaza
when they refused, they broke the international law
now we go to phase two
military operation
now for some men resources, there were few units who go on those ships, matzesa unit who specialize in non lethal force weapon (they train many units across europe, escpially units who serve in jails, where you need non lethal force) and the main unit who took part are the navy seals
the navy seals board with non lethal weapons such as the FN paint ball and regular paint balls gun like you play in your favourit paint ball park
along with those, they have their personal side arm on their legs
intel said the boat are filled with peaceful men (guess WHY)
your only question of how middle aged men got shot in the head
well i can give you another question
why a dog lick his balls?
answer: HE CAN
navy seals who are well trained, seeing their friends get stabbed by a mob who wear bullet proof vests, and stealing their friends side arms will get shot in the head
no question there
and im still amazed by you europeans thinking the blockadge is not justify
but hey, egypt have the same blockadge, lets ram israel !
With regards to the type of Israeli personal boarding the ship, that is of no consequence; the Israeli armed-forces cannot justify later actions because of their poor planning. Your suggestion that Israeli armed-forces were justified in shooting multinational civilians in the head (repeatedly) in international waters shows you are not interested in resolving the issue; one, the IDF should never have boarded the ship because they are far more effective ways to maintain a naval blockade—Israel should deployed warships, and then stopped and searched ships entering Gaza; two, the IDF should never have boarded the ship because they could not prove its passengers were guilty without endangering Israel's own political position—that is, Israel attempts to justifies its action after finding evidence on-board the ship, which they have failed to do; and three, if the IDF has to board a ship they do not do it in the middle of the night, instilling a siege mentality in the passengers, who can wear whatever they want to be honest (you are going to get laughed out of court if you suggest they were supporting Hamas because they wearing bullet-proof vests and hitting Israeli soldiers with bars, knifes and sticks), and they should have either used plastic bullets and shot below the waist.
The entire operation was amateurish.
as a soldier in the idf who was stationed in egypt-israel boarder, you have no idea how much they kill rape and sometimes not in the same order, refugees from sudan
we film these all the time and send it to the UN but nothing happen and its like that for years
the killing of the protesters (you cant seriously calling ppl who want to be shaidz and breaking the law and attacking soldiers protesters never the less peace protesters but ok what ever)
it was jestify
the blockade is legal you can check it what ever
and yes they did break the international law by trying to break the blockade and thats the main point of the argument
no weapons were found?
the idf state that they found weapons and found evidence of "hot weapons"
oh but wait you prolly right man
the poor ppl of gaza are so hungry they gonna eat a nice meal of bullet proof vest and for disert some nice camo suits :XD
for the rest of your planning all i could say
i salut you general armchair !!!
the planes you gave here, i will email them to the prime minister for further operations
the mission was suppose to be simple
board the peaceful ship with peaceful protesters
and navigate it to port
the angry mob of shaidz and criminals/terrorists cause what happened next
and when a commando soldier with a side arm is getting lynched by 12 ppl around him who run with knifes and metal pole in order to kill him
you srsly surprise why ppl got shot in the head from close range? :XD
the boarding on the ships in international water was jestify since they got warnings not to break the blockade
periode
Again, you are not addressing the issues I raised. You repeat that the naval blockade is legal but do not justify why it is legal, and you ignore the suggestions I raised and use irrelevant evidence (Egypt) to support your conclusion (that the troops were justified in killing the protesters) rather than your argument (that the naval blockade was legal, thus the boarding of the ship was legal).
Do you not see how repetitive your argument is? '[Y]es they did break the international law by trying to break the blockade and thats the main point of the argument'.'[T]he boarding on the ships in international water was [justified] since they got warnings not to break the blockade'. Do you not realise you are not proving anything; you are not proving why the blockade is legal? I will repeat: there is only one way Israel can justify boarding the ship, and that is to prove that the passengers on-board the ship were aiming to support Hamas. IDF sources have said the weapons the passengers used were obtained from Israeli soldiers boarding the ship, some of which was throw immediately overboard, yet you justify the action taken, calling the passengers an 'angry mob of shaidz and criminals/terrorists'. If, as you suggest, the IDF found evidence of hot weapons—they haven't and they and other Israeli sources have admitted that they have not found any hot weapons—then why did the IDF not suffer one single casualty? Seriously, think about it. Despite being armed with hot weapons and mobbing the Israeli soldiers, the IDF did not suffer one single casualty. Why you fail to consider the likelihood that the passengers did not in fact have any hot weapons is beyond me; a complete failure of imagination as far as I am concerned.
http://www.mag.idf.il/592-4071-en/patzar.aspx
it will guid you step by step why everything was legit
you keep saying that the protestors otbained the guns from the commandos so what evidance you have that it was not the protestors who shot their own friends in the head in order to blame israel?
the improvised weapons the protestors had needed a long time to make and prepare
which shows you what were their intentions
how come out of six peace ships (some time ago the rachel cory or what ever its name was also took over by israeli commandos) only the marmara was causing problems?
i have proven you again and again why everything was legit but you keep saying that in order to board the ship there should be intent to support hamas with weapons and thats NOT TRUE
IN ORDER TO BOARD THE SHIP, THE SHIP SHOULD ONLY BREAK THE BLOCKADE
but never the less, the marmara DID have army metirials such as bullet proof vest and camo suits
the website i gave you will answer why the blockade is legal and justify
"I will repeat: there is only one way Israel can justify boarding the ship, and that is to prove that the passengers on-board the ship were aiming to support Hamas. IDF sources have said the weapons the passengers used were obtained from Israeli soldiers boarding the ship, some of which was throw immediately overboard"
again you are wrong
israel can board the ship if they are trying to break its blockade and ignore the warnings
the ship was searched for weapons by the government it was sailed from
from there the protestors used tools and made WEAPONS (if i kill someone with a stick i will be charged for killing with a lethal weapon)
their intents were clear along with the videos of the passangers claiming that they want to be shaidz
the israeli media show pictures of bullet proofs vests and rifle scopes and gas masks AND NIGHT VISION GOOGLES
do you understand that night vision googles consider as killing weapon ?
http://www.inn.co.il/News/News.aspx/205114
there goes your point that israeli media did not report of such things
do you even saw israeli media reports?
because in all of them you see these weapons
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6sAEYpHF24
you can see stun grenades throws towards the israeli soldiers
thats a weapon
it was on the ship
now maybe in your logic i proved you that there was weapon = its justify
but the findings of weapons doesnt matter since the right to board the ships is only because they broke the blockade which i proved you is justify
D:
i will stop commenting from now on
maybe in different time, we could be friends :(
DUDE TILL YESTERDAY U DIDNT GIVE TO GAZA KIDS SWEETS AND CHIPS AND SHIT LIEK TAHT
ITS THAT SOM EKIND OF PUNISMHENT???????????????????????????????????????????
CATALANS WOULD NEVER DO THAT TO SPAIN
http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=285242
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://www.paltoday.com/arabic/News-64161.html
http://www.yellowpages.com.ps/category/playgrounds-and-amusement-parks/3/Mjk4NV9fX0FsbF9fX18gXw==/
http://www.yellowpages.com.ps/category/Playgrounds-and-Amusement-Parks/gaza/1/Mjk4NV8xNV8wXyBfMF9TZWFyY2ggQ2F0ZWdvcnlfXyBf/
leaving to nl now:)))
http://twitter.com/IsraelGlobalPR
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaiMjAULWn0
got physics finals in a couple of weeks, haven't started learning yet :(
missed all astro lessons so i have literally no idea.... :e
its gonna be 50 theory/50 tasks and i forgot much of it in 3 years D:
how come from all the vessels that acompany the marmara, they were also taken over but no one died there or even got hurt?
you saw the vids from yourself of the ppl were on the marmara
you saw for yourself the ihh resulotion
with ppl and a mob like this, how the fuck you ask how those ppl got hurt from the first place
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSAxAj2KIdU
damn man, bunch of nice ppl
are all european peace ppl are like this?