Mousesettings²

I have always been interested in the technical aspects of ET. This article is ment as an expansion to 'Mousesettings for newbies". Much like Mousesettings for newbies I do not claim the stuff I talk about will work for everybody. In theory the stuff I write about is correct, in practice most ppl prefer to play with what they are used to play.

First off, I believe in consistency. ET as a game that has a certain 'lotto' factor built into it thanks to spread, antilag and the teambase factor =] You can however reduce this 'lotto' factor by playing
a) intelligently, taking calculated risks which give you a good chance of succeeding automaticly giving you enough of advantage to overcome but the biggest lotto. Playing intelligently requires both the attitide to analyze oneself and to practice practice practice!
b) aim consistent xD

The first thing is nothing I can do about. Some people were just born as plug and play, some ppl have a tendancy to try to understand. The second thing you can improve on. First you want your aim to be as consistent as possible. This is why so much people play relative low sensitivity in ET. You might be able to aim perfectly with sensitivity 5 cm = 180° but you need a way higher concentration to reach the same kind of tracking. Relative low sensitivity makes your aim more consistent, i'm saying relative as some players take this lowering of sensitivity to a new level which seriously hurts their playstyle of forces them to use fov/senstoggles.

Next you need a stable FPS, stable mouserate and a displayrefresh at least as high as your framerate. Ofcourse this is all theory. Some pc's just cant get stable fps, some monitors only give 75hz etc. But lets have a look at the theory. How can we make our aiming more consistent / predictable / stable.

As explained in "Mousesettings by newbies" removing acceleration is a good way to go. Either use accelfix or use your mousedrivers to remove the acceleration. Ofcourse if you have been using windows inbuilt accel for ages, I dont recommend turning it off. CPC showed that there are only two characteristics shared by all top players: Big ass mousemats and relative low sensitivity compared to other games like CoD or Quake. A lot of the players were using the windows inbuilt accel or just didnt give a shit and played with what they played for ages.

So how can you make your aim more consistent? Synching! So what is synching. Lets say i'm playing the piano and playing 2 notes a second, while Loekino is playing the drums, also at 2 beats a second. Both of us will be playing in synch, as we will either play a beat at the same time, or the interval between beats will always be constants. Say if loekino plays his first beat 0,2 seconds earlier, the next beat he plays will also be 0,2 earlier. Also Loekino could be playing 4 beats a second, while i'm only playing 2 beats a second. Common sense tells you he is still playing in synch with me. All sounds nice.

So lets apply synching to ET. What would we want to synch? FPS and Mouserate. Every time a frame gets rendered Q3 looks at the mouseinputs previously received. Say we got 1 frame per second and 1 mouseinput a second, the interval between frame and input will be [1-1000]ms. If we got 125 frames per second and 125 mouseinputs the interval will be in [0-8]ms. Notice that 125 fps = 125/1000ms = 8ms

I say [1-8]ms as there is no way to predict if frames or mouseinput will be 'perfectly' synched: the ms before the frame got rendered a mouseinput was received so the delay between mouseinput and frame is 1 ms. Or the 'worstest' synched: the ms after a frame got rendered and mouseinput was processed, a new mouseinput was received. The maximum delay between mouseinput and frame will be 8ms.

So how could we do better 'in theory'. We cannot increase the FPS due to config restrictions preventing spreadlaming. So the only thing we can do is increase the mouserate. As shown with loekino's drumming, we want to double the mouserate to keep the beats in tune. So if we have 125fps / 250hz the delay interval will be [1-4]ms.
The 'bestest' synch: 1ms, a frame gets rendered the ms after an input was received.
The 'worstest' synch: 4ms, just before the frame got rendered a mouseinput was received. This time the interval is 4 because mouseinputs are beeing sent at double the speed.

Continuing this line of thinking we should decide 1000hz is the 'bestestest' synched as it in theory should give you a 1ms interval as mouseinputs are beeing sent 1000 times a second and there will always be a mouseinput the ms before the frame. In rL mouse dont give stable 1000hz polling rates. You can check it out for yourself: even while doing the most fast circles on your mousemat its impossble to keep a stable 1000hz. This results in loekino skipping some beats and in the end the delay that was constant turns into one big chaos.

fps= 125 = 8ms usb= average 666
frames 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
inputs. 1 1 0 1 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 1 0 0 1 0 1 1 1 0 0 1 1 0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 1 1 1 1 0 1 1 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 1 1 1

So lets take the highest possible mouserate thats stable at all times?
fps= 125 = 8ms usb= 500 stable
frames 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
inputs. 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0
OR
frames 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
inputs. 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1
As you can see no matter what the the mouseinputs will be stable, the delay will be a constant 1 or 2 ms. But what happens if you got a shit pc that doesnt do 125fps?

fps= 100 =10ms usb= 500 stable
frames 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
inputs. 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0

As you can see there is no problem when using lower fps as long as the 500/ fps = integer 1,2,3, etc. The result is you will have a fixed amount of beats every frame, a fixed amount of mouseinputs per frame. This results in a more consistent tracking.
500fps
250fps
166fps
125
100
83
71
63

Long story short:
use 500hz
cap fps: 125, 100, 83, 71, 63

Stuff missing:
prerendered frame limits ;)
direct input, buffering

To be continued:
Antilag and me, I have known :'(
Comments
69
nice :)
1st : i just go in game set a sensitivity and play :p
This is easier

Edit : 2nd :<
I do the same in Quake. ET however has some very weird kind of aim, prolly the reason why its the most patched community out there.
Parent
BULLSHIT
I DONT BELIEVE IT
so i have 85hz G5 500 hz 14sens 400dpi what should my fps be? i have set it to 166 and its pretty stable but whats the better fps for it?
he says 125 TRUST HIM AFTER ALL HE IS UBERDRIVE
Parent
you can use 166 for now, but afaik ESL already capped it at 125 and the new CB config which only needs to be certified will have it capped at 125 also.
Parent
why cap it, are they retarded? first the overbrightbits etc and now this!@!!@@@@
Parent
Its the only way to somehow prevent ppl abusing fps/mouseinput bug so they have no aimspread. If you use 250fps 125hz you have almost no aimspread.
Parent
you just busted butchji:D
Parent
there were some players who used it and were really surprised when SHG used updated ESL config :P
Parent
I WASNT MUAHAHAHAH
Parent
maybe thats why so many sucked so fucking bad(but not the ones that played cpc1)
Parent
I'm sure some really didnt know about this and had been playing with it for ages. Besides, all noobs running com_maxfps 0 and default mouserate are 'abusing' it without knowing it.
Parent
depends on their pc :-D
Parent
120 hz @ monitor, 500hz @ mouse 125 fps with 1600 dpi and 180 degrees for 45cm ftw
45cm for 180 degrees you mean


edit: lowsenser :[
Parent
antilag.... that isn't much work; DISABLE IT AND BAN ALL LAGGERS!
prerenderlimit.... petition against opengl to have a prerenderlimit less than 2 frames!
direct input.... would be nice if prerenderlimit = 0.
dunno if it works but with nhancer u can set opengl prerender limit to 0
Parent
you can set it to 0 and 1 but afaik it automaticly works at 2? Checking it out shouldn't be that hard if you run your own server, and try very low framerates.
Parent
ANDERS DOE JIJ FF MEE AAN DE SLIMNEUZERIJ AWARD
anyone has a link for a good proggy to check/cap my mouserate?
You talk about synching, what about syncing FPS, maxpackets and display refresh, wouldn't that sync better?

My monitor can 'only' do 100 hertz at a playable resolution(r_mode 6, everything below that looks too bad for me). So which mouseherts would be the best then?
FPS > MOUSERATE > RESOLUTION > MAXPACKETS

first choose an fps you can keep stable, try it out on a pub running goldrush and see if its stable.

mouserate at 500

FPS = Maxpackets
If FPS is higher then 100, maxpackets will be halved, ET doesnt support maxpackets higher then 100.
So at 125 fps you better cap at 63, so if you do get fps lag and go under 100 it will stay at 63 rather then jumping to 100 during the fps lag. When using 100 or lower fps, just keep maxpackets at 100 as it wont affect anything and it will prevent ppl whining.

Display = as high as you can get it
Parent
Ok... I think I get it now :).

How do these things transfer to other games such as quake 4? (or any other game that doesn't use the Q3 engine.)
Parent
I'm using 120Hz with 125 fps atm, but it would be better use higher displayrefresh?

I can set it up to 160
Parent
Nope, no reason to. But most ppl wont get that far, and playing 100fps - 100 hz is a real bitch ;)
Parent
well, I use r_mode 4

I have tried 100 fps but it's just not smooth enough :)

and don't u get tearing with that?
Parent
100 - 100 gives tearing all the way, has something to do with you actually seeing the frames beeing rendered, meaning half the screen is still the old one, and the other half is the new one :'(
Parent
so, why is it good to play like that then :S ?

wouldn't 100fps with 120Hz be better?

and if fps is stable, could it be rather higher than 125?
Parent
theres no point of increasing the hz if you dont increase the fps along with it

125fps will be the max you will be able to cap it at, just like in rtcw. In a slow paced game like ET there's really no need of 1ms flickshots etc, so why allow more if ppl could abuse it?
Parent
I never played rtcw so I don't know about it, but what do u mean with it can't be capped higher than 125?
Parent
why not 125 fps and 100hz???
Parent
You will lose 25 frames :/ A human eye can easily pick up 125 frames. The reaction time of your mouse will not be affected by the display refresh, but some of the information your eyes would normally notice, gets lost. If your monitor can handle it, I suggest 120hz, as you will lose only 5 frames. At higher displayrefreshes you will actually duplicate certain frames, show them twice, which isnt a good idea either imho :P
Parent
but i cant do 120 hz only 100hz and if i play with 100fps its tears and that is annoying
Parent
That reallity 4u :P As I commented in the bottom, its something to aim for.
Parent
cos of my graphiccard
Parent
r_mode 4 @ 120hz but r_mode 4 sucks hard
Parent
Indeed, just make a choice. Its just a goal, not a dogma.
Parent
NEDERLANDSE VERSIE!!!!!
that's geek but i fuckin like it
sod off :>

i'll stick with

1000hz @ 72fps @ 75hz thxs vmuch
500mhz,100fps,100pckts,85displayref
well done?
why use bigger fps then you have on monitor refresh
use maxfps 85 packets 85 and hz 85 if 85 is your max hz
Parent
no interrest :(, als je 1 setting verander erger je je weer aan een andere kut setting
useless disable mouse accel set your mouse sens and go :D
"use 500hz"
even if my mouse cant do it really stable?
i dont understand shit of all those settings, i just took a cfg and adjusted fov and mouse sens

dont understand anything about refreshrate, mhz, etc...
76FPS > 500hz > 1024x768 > 76maxpackets

That is what i use :p dunno if it's perfect

***Edit***

If I try to lock my FPS at 63 it will raise to a 66.7 stable FPS

So it will be 66.7FPS >500hz > 1024x768 > 100maxpackets > rate is 25000
because 63 aint possibole :<
62

edit: why would you want to cap your fps that low?
Parent
for good performance and no whine about hitable ? if i understood overdrive well ?
Parent
Agree, keep some common sense. If you are using 76fps 500hz, just keep your settings. This is only the 'theory'. In practice you could prefer higher fps or your old settings.
Parent
Je zithouding :P




>:D
Nicely done Overdrive :]
bah, it finished just when u started talking interesting things, like prerender limit etc :)
And if I can't get 500hz stable?
its only theory, it means its what you are aiming for. In reality some people will prefer to play at 76 as its faster then 71. Some ppl wont get 500hz stable, but average of 450. You still have a high mouserate so care.

The magical 500hz/125fps/120hz is something to aim for rather then fucking up all your settings just to get something 'synched'.

If you buy a new pc and get 125 fps stable, this is what I recommend to any player. Got a tft, np still keep playing 125fps. Cant tweak usbport at lan, 125hz will still do fine. And if you are playing 76fps 75hz 500hz you are using what a lot of the pros are using, its not perfect but reality never is ;)
Parent
im using 76 fps, 100 maxpackets, monitor 75hz, mAus 500hz

and thats the best what i've get
Same here =)
Parent
76/76/75/500 in ET
125/125/120/1000 in Quake, theres really not much tracking in Quake and the uberhigh polling rate is nice for fast flicks and rails.
Parent
I really can't find something about mouserate in my mouse-settings :<<
tutorials item 6
Parent
Yup, just found it. Thanks.
Parent
ja hoor hij is weer bezig :D
i am using:

G5 @ 1000Hz / 400dpi
ET @ 125fps (unstable on radar only) r_mode 8
LCD @ 75Hz
cl_maxpackets 100

i've big problems with shooting on long range (fov 100) maybe it sounds stupid but when opponent hit me my crosshair fly away (around 3cm ingame) and its hard to point it back before i get killed
G5 is usb 2.0 device, and always works at 500hz

the crosshair shaking is just an animation, you should just continue to aim as if your crosshair were still in the same position
Parent
ye it is 2.0 but after i bought my mouse im playing with 1000Hz. Is there smtn wrong? What about ET settings, is all ok there? Ye i know its normal but when im specing other players they don't have probbs with that. If the opponent give me only one body shoot cross fly away but not a litlle bit a lot and its fucking annoying. Sorry my english its not perfect.Hope u understand it what i wanna say..
Parent
oshiet. put it to 500hz.
now got new Reflex record also :D
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