Serious Discussion: Sharia Law in Britain
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7 Oct 2008, 21:33
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OK, lets get this out of the way straight away. I am NOT condoning or citing any sort of racial hatred and/or trolling.
There are a multitude of countries and religions that visit Crossfire and it would be nice to get a fully fledged opinion from various sides of the world regarding this.
Pat Condell puts it into better words than I do but personally I don't really mind people coming into the country LEGALLY but I really detest the fact that they think they can push laws from other countries onto us and make us teach Islamic practices in our schools, this is OUR country (Britain) and OUR rules, we wouldn't come to your country and demand that you start teaching and preaching our laws, it's just not done.
Watch these two videos to get an overall idea of my opinion on this matter, again, I don't want to spark any sort of racial or religion hatred, this is a controversial thread but I want actual opinions from people who have a least some sort of brain and can make a post that coincides with what I set out with this thread, a serious discussion.
Video 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ox2-Wun2dIg
Video 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-KHHKuVVRc
Pat Condell seems the sort of guy we could with leading the country but alas, when would someone who would change and help the country find their selves in any sort of authority role? It doesn't and won't happen. Sure, Blair may have had a good go at it but at the end of the day he was a puppet to the cause and never really had an intellectual opinion.
I guess this will be interesting.
Please read the entire thread AND videos before you make a post. I really do mean this as a serious discussion.
Edit:
Little bit more reading material for people who are genuinely interested.
Sharia Law "unavoidable" in Britain: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7232661.stm
There are a multitude of countries and religions that visit Crossfire and it would be nice to get a fully fledged opinion from various sides of the world regarding this.
Pat Condell puts it into better words than I do but personally I don't really mind people coming into the country LEGALLY but I really detest the fact that they think they can push laws from other countries onto us and make us teach Islamic practices in our schools, this is OUR country (Britain) and OUR rules, we wouldn't come to your country and demand that you start teaching and preaching our laws, it's just not done.
Watch these two videos to get an overall idea of my opinion on this matter, again, I don't want to spark any sort of racial or religion hatred, this is a controversial thread but I want actual opinions from people who have a least some sort of brain and can make a post that coincides with what I set out with this thread, a serious discussion.
Video 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ox2-Wun2dIg
Video 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-KHHKuVVRc
Pat Condell seems the sort of guy we could with leading the country but alas, when would someone who would change and help the country find their selves in any sort of authority role? It doesn't and won't happen. Sure, Blair may have had a good go at it but at the end of the day he was a puppet to the cause and never really had an intellectual opinion.
I guess this will be interesting.
Please read the entire thread AND videos before you make a post. I really do mean this as a serious discussion.
Edit:
Little bit more reading material for people who are genuinely interested.
Sharia Law "unavoidable" in Britain: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7232661.stm
I'd separate England from Wales and classify them as French, Scotland can come down next to Wales and we'll create one hell of a motherfucking party involving mead and whiskey \m/
The torys where to start =[
Sure it will all settle down eventually but I don't see anything drastic before 2010, I think we are in quite a bad state globally at the moment and shit needs fixing. But I am getting away from the point of the thread.
UK politics is going down the pan and we could do with someone who can inspire some life into the country and deliver promises. We need Churchill.
The UK receives the most foreign investment in Europe and it's growing. In a few years we'll make more money than Germany.
We own the "biggest" company in the world (HSBC - a bank) and the likes of Barclays have actually profited from the demise of the American giants, and have full support of the Chinese, who're one of its biggest investors.
The UK banking system is consolidating its position in the world and getting rid of the dead weight. A lot of the problems are caused by capitalism and multi-national companies. We can't have the best of both worlds. If you want to borrow money then we've to accept that crashes like this happen every couple of decades.
The only problem is... the pound got a huge historical value :D
I also think GB is not gonna change to euro, besides the historical value its the most strongest currency in the world, you should be proud of that :D
You were doing so well until this bold idealist statement, that simply is not on the cards in the slightest.
"The amount of money the UK would make from switching to the euro would be negligible."
This is an interesting debate, London is the gateway to Europe for Asia and the US as all the major airlines have their biggest European base at Heathrow. One argument is that by changing to the Euro they would then have no further need to leave London to conduct their business. It's an argument that has quite some flaws, but with London being the busiest international hub and now according to many editors the economic capital of the world, does it help or hinder us to be out of the euro.
I'd like to see a political party that has been sitting on the sidelines gathering what small support they can to rule for a few years to see what we could potentially get in terms of new and improved (or vice versa) laws and such.
the flipside to that coin though is this. when youre in a foreign country, you live by their laws and rules, or pay the consequences. if you go to holland, and smoke weed in the street, you might get jailed. if you visit yemen, and try to open up a new catholic chapel, youll get lynched, its not done. so why treat someone in the uk differently cos of their religion or colour of skin? you live in the uk, ok, you dont call youreself british, but if youre here, abide by our laws or face the same deal that any other person not abiding to our laws gets. dont invent a whole new law system for someone who CHOSE to live here. no-one made them live here, they CHOSE to. so rules apply to you to.
The fact that we now have all of these words or phrases that can be called racist is BEYOND a joke. Things like "Blackboard" and "Black Sheep" being racist is absolutely pathetic. A blackboard. Christ, it's been called that for years. It's a board that's coloured black. That's it. We are not saying it looks like the local immigrant from Bangladesh, we don't even incite it. It's true, as you say, that anyone not a British nationalist can be called a racist and it's, to be frank, beyond a joke.
Of course, we need to make people welcome to the country, they obviously come here for a reason. We MUST be doing something good in order to have literally thousands of people swarming the the country.
we all have to live in the uk. we live by our laws, every day, we pay our taxes on just about everything, and sometimes twice on certain things (lol) , asians pay these taxes too, so they get the same say we do, im sure a lot of them pay a lot more taxes than your average uk punter who sits on the social, not wanting to work. but it is GREAT BRITAIN , its a fucking marvellous place to live if you stop and look at it for a while, really take it in and watch what goes on, and ive watched for the last 15 years as its gone from bad, to worse, crimes up, vandalism's up,unemployments through the roof, we're in a credit crunch, at war in a foreign land with an unseen enemy thats killing our boys in the name of a god thats 3000 years old and hasnt moved with the times like the good old bible has! (lol) i hate religion, all of it, i think its scaremongery and nothing more, playing on scared people looking for guidence who arent strong enough to believe in themselves and look to a "higher being" to live their lives by. lot of outdated crap .
p.s if there is a god, sorry mate, i was only kidding and trying to look cool, dont smite me :<
Globalisation means our role in the world has changed. Our economy like any other advanced western country, including Germany, is based on services and finance. Education also has a big role
Being well off means you can afford to ignore politics. But, I assure you the difference between the conservatives of the '80s and early to mid-'90s is stark compared with Labour. I can write a big long list of things that Labour has done for me and my family and I'm only 20 - I've barely lived.
Np for me if ur black,white,green,yellow,blue,purple,farmer,citizen,tall,small,if you have blue eyes or brown, if your a quite big piece of a population we should listen to your wishes also but keep in mind.. oh wait let me explain this with a discussion we had in holland lately. Some folk said we should make the "sugarparty" ,dont know the english word, after the rammadan (thats a islamitic word if i m right?) a national partyday. As a country based on jewish/christian believes we cant simple accept that. Then you cross the border imo....
listen to their wishes is fine but there are boundaries.
If you are going to rile against having religion in the school system then don't be picky about which religion.
Do it france style and ban any religion symbol from being worn. Stop all religions from being able to create and run schools.
They always start with "I'm not trying to be racist" but what it boils down to is pretty much just racist rants
I fucking hate the BNP. I loathe patriotism and despise racism
I'm also against all religions so I don't have any special beef with Islam. Well actually I do. It's direct opposition to the emancipation of women for one thing.
They don't piss me off as much as the creationists do, mind you.
Now?
I would say yes. You would disagree?
I do get pissed off at a lot of the shit "St. Paul" wrote in his letters but that shit isn't exactly enforced anymore.
I'm actually shocked anyone would suggest that Islam has a higher opinion of women than Christianity...
EDIT: Why did you bring up Christianity anyway?
I'm not a Christian. :S
It's a case of liking socialism but hating the socialists as Orwell would say.
Christianity has been forced to make concessions in just about every way to remain somewhat relative to a liberal Western (European) society. It's government legislation not Christianity which forced change.
I disagree. It should be easy, but this country has an increasingly sensitive attitude towards those who criticise Islam.
You know why? It's a four letter word.
Fear.
The West appears to have decided that a war of attrition is the only way to win over religious states (direct invasion in worst case scenarios). We're positioning ourselves so that any "war" or forced intervention will be a just cause. Secular Western society will slowly suck the poison from power.
" Secular Western society will slowly suck the poison from power." and what, the,fuck, does that mean? have you worded this sentence FULL of wisdom slightly incorrectly? or is it, as im leaning towards anyway, you trying to look as if you know what youre talking about, when secretly, you quote others to look less boring?
Secular Western society is democracy and capitalism served through globalisation. Religion has no place in government and will eventually be removed, even in the extreme Islamic states like Pakistan or Iran.
Which do you think little Muslim Jimmy prefers; playing his PS4 or serving as a solider in a Jihad in 10 years time (and dying before he's 20)? After seeing how Chandler and Monica are like on friends, he decides he doesn't what five slaves, he wants a wife who he can talk and play around with. So he takes his girlfriend to McDonalds and then onto the pictures to watch an American movie.
We don't need to fight or isolate "them". We win by showing how great it's to be British and in a Western society. How accommodating it's. How great and diverse our culture is. We've done it in Asia already. The middle East is nothing.
Why shouldn't mosques be allowed to be built? We've places of worship for just about every religion. We also have faith schools for every religion. There are always going to be isolated communities where people prefer to speak their own language. There's a huge Jewish community in Gateshead. Just like there's huge Muslim communities in Birmingham.
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The irony is of course that we debate and decide not to allow "Islam" (or any immigrant nation/culture) to taint our culture because it's our culture, our language and our country. Turn the clock back even a little and you'll see we were carving up Arab land to give to Jews, or for our own Empire. We were forcing our entire system down their necks.
Then there's "our" culture. You'll find it was the Arab world who preserved the Roman and Greek culture and helped Europe rediscover our past. They're one of the most cultured peoples in history and western media portrays like them they're animals who know nothing.
It's complete hypocrisy. We're beginning to sound like Nazi's in the '30s. Our language is great because we've stolen the best bits from other languages, including Arabic. Our culture is one of the most diverse and accommodating in the world; you can probably go out and find an Indian or Chinese within 10mins if you live in a town (my village at home even has a Chinese). Why not add some Arabic food to the list?
It's just ignorance. The media inciting racial hatred to make it sound like we're under attack or being invaded. 92% of the UK is White. Just remember that.
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Look at BAE Systems (the third largest arms dealer in the world - British), Saudi Arabia is one of if not our biggest customers. The government willingly overlooks huge cases of corruption so the UK economy will profit. It's a bridge for co-operation.
If you read the Bible or the Qu'ran you would be shocked to discover that (at a scripture level!) Islam does actually have a higher opinion of women than the old testament.
It's less Islam but middle-eastern culture which has held women back. Go back a couple of thousand years and Judaism and Islam are probably not too different ;_;
I already addressed the history of their opinions on women and I agree with you. As for middle-eastern culture holding them back...what exactly is the justification for the subjugation of women in middle eastern culture? By the way, I must underline this overly general "middle eastern culture" you speak of. I would bet that Israel is culturally different from Saudi Arabia for example. :-)
they banned santa claus and christmas trees in our town centre because "it was an insult to muslim culture"
i dont give a shit i am racist i wouldnt have to think for one second if BNP come to power and i was given the opportunity to kill one of the cunts
i aint fucking bothered with them moving to our country and living by our culture/rules whatever but sorry but its way past that, at least were i live
they're building an asda near where i live, and there were arguments from the local mosque saying they dont want it building because its too close to their place of worship, they said they can only build the asda if they build the mosque users some special car parking spaces, and asda agreed to it.. they get whatever they want otherwise the race card gets played
its a fucking joke
Another example is stuff like piercings etc, if you wear a piercing because you enjoy it, alot of schools and colleges dissalow it as it's in the rules of the college/school but now if this a blessed symbol of mohammed then it's all cool to wear, don't worry the rules will be bent so they don't get a bad word mentioned on them. Just give 'em a free house or somethin' because they have 97 kids with aids
And yeah 'they're' welcome to change anything 'they' chose, assuming 'they've' the votes for it.
PS asylum seekers & migrants are very different people in very different circumstances
Schools offer exemptions to all the religions so I can’t understand the obsession with Islam, other than most have dark skin?
this doesnt affect your country does it? so maybe keep your opinion to yourself...
give me all the fucking warning points u want as well, like its gona stop what opinions i hold over something happening in my own country and in my own city under 5 miles away from my house
What the...?
If you read the linked beeb article
not exactly outrageous is it?
'n jeez can we create a godwins law for anyone that invokes the dreaded 'PC' for anything & everything?