AEF Payday Is Upon Us!

image: AeS

Today is the day you've all been waiting for (or not so much for some). At 9 pm CET (GMT+1), the sales will open. You'll find bankdetails and more information right here when the time comes. Remember only one payment per team, so no partial payments are allowed!

Yet there seem to be many teams and players that didn't read anything about AEF but still want to go. So here is a summary of things you need to know if you want to go to AEF. Now you really have no excuse anymore to not know these bulletpoints!

When to pay:
TODAY, 21:00 CET (20:00 GMT)
Price:
€300

Number of slots:
At least 16, can go up to 48 depending on how many teams sign up fast.

Prizes:
16 teams - €3.000
24 teams - €4.500
32 teams - €6.000
48 teams - €7.500

Need a team or players?
http://www.crossfire.nu/?x=forum&mode=item&id=30161

Other info?
Check out the official newspost: http://www.crossfire.nu/?x=news&mode=item&id=5801
Check out the forum sticky: http://www.crossfire.nu/?x=forum&mode=item&id=30276
Comments
118
its may 21 now, isn't it?
Ye June, May, mixed them up! :P
Parent
perhaps a stupid question but is there coverage in the form of ETTV or quadV or smth like that?
Parent
Yes, Quadv and ETTV!
Parent
nice, be sure to advertise that so ppl know :)
Parent
how many team signuped so far?

that's next week! .... äääähhm .. No?!
wasnt it like u cant "signup" u have to pay on/after may 26th, frist paid first in or something like it ?
Parent
gief signup list plz
The first one who pays is in, that's the sign up process. So right now nobody is "signed up", all sign ups start the 26th.
Parent
so I guess the bank transfer details will be posted on 26th may? do you only want to receive 300€ payments or can each clan let their players pay the individual 60€?
Parent
No partial payments are allowed!
Parent
what happens with the money from the teams that cant play, but did pay?

just a small question to make it clear for me
Parent
The ticket belongs to the one who paid it, so he can sell it to another team. But no refunds are possible.
Parent
[NL](voor de duidelijkheid)
Nadat er 16 teams zijn, zijn er waarschijnlijk nog steeds teams die tickets willen kopen, als die dan geld overmaken, maar de limiet van 24 teams wordt niet bereikt, wat gebeurt er dan? of worden er meteen 8 tickets beschikbaar gesteld voor ET (nadat de eerste 16 zijn verkocht)
[/NL]
and as Worm already asked:
To who are the prizes paid? First 3? 5?
Parent
1) Na een trigger behaald is worden de volgende 8 tickets beschikbaar.
2) Dat is nog niet zeker :)
Parent
I'm gonna sell apple pies :D
How will the price pot be paid? first 3, 5, ... ?
I think it should be

40 teams = 7500
or
48 teams = 9000

otherwise the calculations are wrong.
More teams = more expenses. Costs are more important than a math rule imo.
Parent
without math you coudln't figure out what the costs would be so don't say such bullshit
Parent
?

Don't act as a retard Spiro, thanks.
Parent
your answer was also retarded.. the more teams, the less the costs should raise.. Ofcourse the costs will raise but not as much as in the beginning :) pure economics mate
Parent
I'm sure you're talking out of experience...
Parent
actually he is talking the true :>
the cost function is like the logarithmic one
Parent
But not a realistic one.
Parent
of course more teams is more expenses, but also more income so your argument doesn't make much sense.

I'll paint the picture for you so it might make a little more sense of what I'm trying to say.

each team has to pay 300 for admission.
with 16 teams that means that 3000/16 = 187.5 euro's goes into the pricepot. The other 112.5 goes to expenses and what not.

now let's continue that list

with 24 teams it's 4500/24 = 187.50 euro's
with 32 teams it's 6000/32 = 187.50 euro's
with 48 teams it's 7500/48 = 156.25 euro's

So basically, the more successful the registration is, the least amount of the fee is available for the pricepot, and that in itself doesn't make any sense at all. In any normal business model success means that you can be more efficient with expenses. Take renting out the hangar for instance. The more teams there are, the more income you have and the easier it will be to pay for such expenses.

Now, would it be the case that only a certain number of PC's are available and with more teams than a specific number it would mean you'd have to go to a more expensive source for PC's, then it's understandable, but otherwise I don't see much logic in the fact that 16, 24 and 32 teams means the same amount of money of entrancefee goes into the pot, but with the high amount of 48, only a little more than half goes in. So perhaps you can shed some light as to why these amounts were chosen and how you got to those amounts.
Parent
the only reason why an increasing number of teams would mean more money available is because, like you mentioned, the venue would house more paying 'customers'. in itself this is obviously a valid argument but i can imagine, although i have no experience at all when it comes to organising anything similar, there are a fair number of things which weigh up to the above argument.
Like you said i reckon they will probably need to get their hands on more pc's than originally planned, possibly to a higher rate than the ones they already have. then there might be the need for more people in the organising crew? or they will do it with the same amount of people but it will mean they will have to put more time in to it?

also i dont see why they would need to argue their choices i'm pretty sure seeing as they have already hosted at least one (more?) succesful event before they will know what they are doing.
Parent
To me it just seems the list was upped with 1500 euro's for each jump in team amount but that they didn't realise that the jump from 32 to 48 is 16 extra instead of 8.

But yah, like I said, the only reason I can see if that they'd have to go with a different PC supplier that is more expensive, or that they'd have to rent extra space in the hanger, possibly an extra conference room to host it in that has specific rates or something similar like that. Otherwise it just doesn't make much sense.

As for extra crew members being needed, that is the one thing they'd actually win money on instead of costing more money. I've been involved with organizing a bunch of techno-parties and the same principle applies with increasing numbers here, it simply results in lower overall costs on needed crew.
Parent
you probably make more sense than i do i cba to think about it :P
Parent
While you're correct that normally economies of scale work this way, it does depend on an extent on advance planning. I know, for example, for CIC7 we went way over the projected size and had to start making major increases to the expenses to compensate, proportionally the ~100 PCs we had were far more expensive than the ~60 we normally use.

This shouldn't apply to AEF though, so they should indeed be increasing the proportion of payout as signups increase.
Parent
unless you have insight to the organization of aef, you can not not that this doesn't apply to them ;-)
Parent
typo spotted ...with 48 teams it's 7500/24 = 156.25 euro's
:P
Parent
economy works slightly different in belgium
Parent
in this case Belgium wouldnt produce really nothing, but just import everything for less costs. This would result a very weak economy and poverty in the country :)
Parent
Nope, their bigger companies would just split up as much as possible, and mostly everyone would be running their own small business
Parent
i dont see the connection to the actual problem from ur text. Small companies run even more risiko, and their prices arnt smaller at all. This result even more aggravating problems in the economy, cause furthermore increased import and result the close of producting firms. Proportionate price rising in the concurrent markets doesnt work at all :)
Parent
QuoteBelgium wouldnt produce really nothing

awesome English!!
Parent
Just a double negative.
Parent
so you say that's correct English?
Parent
I am not the one to judge that. There is shitloads of "bad English" on Crossfire everyday and it's useless to point at anyone for a little mistake. Serious engrish is another story.
Parent
Normally I shouldn't talk about all this since it's private information, but yes the expenses increase when teams increase. Firstly, extra crew has to be paid for, but you could argue that since income go up, the increase of expenses for that would be relatively lower. But when we want to house more teams, we'll need more pc's. You can easily pay 4000€ for 16 extra pc's, and that's only 3 teams at the same time. So ye, it's very very expensive, and the sponsordeals only go so far. I really shouldn't be talking about all these specifics, but trust me on this, it gets relatively more expensive.

This being said, why can't the organization (Gamevibes) take a part of the profits when they manage to house more than 32 teams? 32 teams mean that it's a successful lan, which means that beyond that it's fair to give some value back to the organization. We aren't taking any profit from all this when we don't reach more than 32 teams, so cut the organization some slack, they deserve it!

And imo €7.500 is the biggest prizepurse since Quakecon, so I really don't get it why you're complaining about this :/
Parent
To set something straight first, I'm not complaining. I was merely wondering if it wasn't a mistake as the jumps in teams were 8 and the jump in money was 1500, until it went from 32 to 48 teams. That's all.
Parent
Ye it's indeed a good observation :)
Parent
Haha, I was about to write something similar to ronners comment earlier, but didn't cuz I thought I would be revealing too much, but yea to reinforce krosan's statement, there is a limit on PCs available from sponsors, if number of players exceeds the limit of PCs then they have to be acquired elsewhere at a higher cost, which justifies the decrease in payout / entrance fee ratio
Parent
Ye didn't know whether to post this as well or not, but imo it's something each LAN has to worry about, so nothing shocking tbh :P
Parent
Yah I figured it would have to be something of that sense. I initially posted my comment because I thought they just made a mistake when going from 32 to 48, cuz all the jumps were 8 teams/ 1500 euro's ;-) and if that wasn't a mistake, the only thing that makes sense is indeed hitting the limit of pc's and having to outsource for more at a higher price.
Parent
Doesn't the lan have a certain max number of attendees it can hold and is therefore using this trigger system with 16 - 24 - 32 - 48 ? It seems a little strange to me that especially a game which would then bring a large portion of the attendees get relatively lower prizes.
Parent
I wouldn't be able to answer that fully, maybe ask the gamevibes guys.

As far as I know all the limits are based on number of PCs rather then number of attendees. as PCs are the hardest and most expensive thing to get hold of, the venue itself could probably quite easily accommodate 48 teams for all 3 games, keep in mind that this prize scheme is used for all 3 games, So I guess they justified it as: the game(s) that cause the event to exceed the planned allowance of PCs would be the main contributors to the costs of renting additional PCs
Parent
ET is the only game which has only 300€ signup fee, compared to the 350€ for all other games. Hence the lower prizepurse :)
Parent
I know, I meant the jump from 32 to 48 only having the "8 extra teams" increase of prizemoney.
Parent
It's partially also a means to ensure that we'll get break-even.
Parent
got to make money

':D'

love the reply though, pure lolled :O(
Parent
well... cic7 had what, 16 more teams than cc6 with the same entrance fee with the same prizepool...

expenses/organization time/manpower increase with more teams i guess
Parent
thanks for the reminder, eev will signup tomorrow
Quote by Krosan on 21/05/10, 15:45:52 PM | Reply

The first one who pays is in, that's the sign up process. So right now nobody is "signed up", all sign ups start the 26th.
Parent
thanks for the reminder, velerion will signup tomorrow
I hope many et teams will take part, so that ET will get a litte bit more attention
thanks for the reminder, velerion will signup tomorrow
need a team
can you get weed in Belgium?
you can get weed pretty much anywhere in the world, but there are not coffeeshops in belgium that sells it if that's your question.
Parent
its not legal
Parent
You can buy hashish in local maroccan bars, but they will rip you off and the quality is really really shit. You could go to holland but all the towns near Antwerp had to close their coffeeshops so the closest shops atm are in Breda, Etten Leur, all over 40 minutes driving from Antwerp. You are allowed to posses up to 5 gr in Belgium though you arent allowed to consume it in public or near children. pm me btw, I usually got a huge bag of quality haze lying around :)
Parent
I'll bring you some from Holland.
Parent
ok ive decided to come now :P
Parent
ik ben een beetje bang dat het erop neer gaat komen dat er niet heel veel teams naar aef willen :P
The top teams already signed up, now only the others need to follow =)
Parent
hey crossfire god, how about giving him warning level points, since he didnt write english?
Parent
what an odd time removal of sticky, the day before sign ups. hmmm
is da een belgisch banknummer voor de overschrijving? ik sta morgen om 19:00 klaar om te verzenden ;-)
KEREL IK SPEEL NI ME BF WAAT TAAHHH FAAACCKKK

:DDDD

aestas é, ma die hebben al een golden ster naast hun naam ;-)

keep up the good work and gl!
Parent
lees ne keer goe :p
Parent
nice edit! :D
Parent
ok ok ik geef toe dat het mss een heel klein beetje aangepast is :p
Parent
bah zo stom, lan op 15minute van men huis en kzen op vakantie :(
vakantie > lan
Parent
ja natuurlijk, ma allebei was wel leuker geweest :P
Parent
won't pay on my birthday zomg
no I won't make a HB journal for you tomorrow
Parent
let me wake up god damnit
Parent
krosan give us a place :(
our sponsor is paying on friday ...we know its too late :(
Why don't you pay it in advance and let your sponsor pay you back?
Parent
im not responsible of it but i hope sponsor wont think we wonna trick them :DD
Parent
You have a sponsor :/
Parent
How the fuck did your team get lansupport o0
Parent
why not :o
we even have faky in our team !
Parent
really, answer the question, we wanna know. So we can learn how to :)
Parent
if i answer it everyone could get a good sponsor like us :pp
and then nobody would take us :pp
Parent
good point :D

and gl !
Parent
Normally the answer is personal connections. Knowing an employee (especially a manager) from a company related to what you do (in this case, tech companies) is frequently enough to net you a few hundred euros sponsorship.
Parent
for example do you know any of them ?
Parent
How many prized spots will there be, and what will the distribution be like?
I think it depends of how many teams there sign up so it'll prolly take a while till they can tell us that for sure
Parent
you smart boy =)
Parent
Chris Pontius was here
Parent
prove me wrong but i doubt there will be more than 20 teams, and i wish good luck krosan :)
The time changed... is it certain now? I made tentative plans for this evening that I'm now going to have to cancel...
Turns out it was a good thing - my secretary fucked up my hotel booking and I only just got online in another hotel!
Parent
w00t w00t

ps: is she hot?
Parent
Really, really not.
Parent
I didn't know of this since two hours ago. Something to do with the higher management :/
Parent
saiko ready to pay :D
Back to top