Its funny how I also seem to play devils advocate in these cases but just like with RazZ I think there is a case for the defence. Shy and Keran are both pending a ban from Clanbase which would see one of the most successful teams in 2007 expelled from Eurocup XV and yet there is something of a grey area to be examined. I'm not interested in defending them, simply highlighting the difficulty of the decision ahead.
Here you have two players who have no shame in showing their faces at lan and have (at least in Keran's case) been very active in the ET LAN scene. They are without doubt two very talented players without the use of external programs. They were in zeroPoint on their merits that they proved again and again, suddenly that proof is washed away by one stupid mistake, but if they are 90% likely to get a ban, is it right?
There is the famous case in Clanbase of CounterStrike hero
Natu who was playing for 4kings at the time. This man hacked in a ladder match of all things, but had attended more CPL's than most ppl ever will, he has proven to be one of the very best and yet he is banned because he hacked in a CB official. Right decision? I think so, theres a clear difference in my eyes between publics and a CB official regardless of your ability to prove your credentials.
But this isnt the same as Keran and _shy, and no I'm not writing this with any vested interest in their success as I've nothing to do with zP since the austrians left. They hacked on a public and were flagged as a result, apparently they've admitted it and it is not in doubt, what is in doubt is whether its right to ban them from a competition they are currently playing very well in.
Clanbases rules do state:
"In-game cheating outside ClanBase: On a Public / Clan server: 6 month ban"
However what do you care more about? Banning those players who you cant prove hack, but clearly do or banning someone that cheated on a public but is still better than most players in the game without that cheat.
It was Lotix's comment that really got me wondering whether there are people who are in favour of pardon'ing their error, he states:
I asked
m1lk of Impact Gaming what it felt like to lose to these two last night and his response was interesting:
Impact, m1lk and mystic are out of the most prestigious online tournament to a team harbouring 2 players poised to be banned by Clanbase, how does that make you feel?
I ask you whether your opinion would be the same if Night was on the other end of this. If Night got banned from Clanbase for hacking on a public server it would reduce the accuracy of the result of the Eurocup, I for one would be very much against seeing him banned just for a pub hack, should I be against this case too then?
Clanbase's decision will be very interesting, personally I will understand which one they make and I really do not envy the job of Adacore or Bulld0g, whoever has to make this one, its got to be the hardest decision in the cheat busting world of ET.
Here you have two players who have no shame in showing their faces at lan and have (at least in Keran's case) been very active in the ET LAN scene. They are without doubt two very talented players without the use of external programs. They were in zeroPoint on their merits that they proved again and again, suddenly that proof is washed away by one stupid mistake, but if they are 90% likely to get a ban, is it right?
There is the famous case in Clanbase of CounterStrike hero
Natu who was playing for 4kings at the time. This man hacked in a ladder match of all things, but had attended more CPL's than most ppl ever will, he has proven to be one of the very best and yet he is banned because he hacked in a CB official. Right decision? I think so, theres a clear difference in my eyes between publics and a CB official regardless of your ability to prove your credentials. But this isnt the same as Keran and _shy, and no I'm not writing this with any vested interest in their success as I've nothing to do with zP since the austrians left. They hacked on a public and were flagged as a result, apparently they've admitted it and it is not in doubt, what is in doubt is whether its right to ban them from a competition they are currently playing very well in.
Clanbases rules do state:
"In-game cheating outside ClanBase: On a Public / Clan server: 6 month ban"
However what do you care more about? Banning those players who you cant prove hack, but clearly do or banning someone that cheated on a public but is still better than most players in the game without that cheat.
It was Lotix's comment that really got me wondering whether there are people who are in favour of pardon'ing their error, he states:
I asked
m1lk of Impact Gaming what it felt like to lose to these two last night and his response was interesting:Impact, m1lk and mystic are out of the most prestigious online tournament to a team harbouring 2 players poised to be banned by Clanbase, how does that make you feel?
I ask you whether your opinion would be the same if Night was on the other end of this. If Night got banned from Clanbase for hacking on a public server it would reduce the accuracy of the result of the Eurocup, I for one would be very much against seeing him banned just for a pub hack, should I be against this case too then?
Clanbase's decision will be very interesting, personally I will understand which one they make and I really do not envy the job of Adacore or Bulld0g, whoever has to make this one, its got to be the hardest decision in the cheat busting world of ET.
They do not deserve more rights than any other player that gets a ban for cheating on a public.
Next season EC will have 70 clans.
i believe they dont hack anymore but they deserve the ban soz
in this case the casino would be cb, and playing poker with some mates with a few drinks would be the public server.
but i agree cheating newhere deserves the ban.
/ just my opinion [whine]
you really care if you play agains't some1 who has cheated in public? and why wouldn't those ppl be busted again if they were cheating
http://yawn.be/findPlayer.yawn?nick=chmpp&pbGuid=&etproGuid=&gamecode=ET
i only know that it's pissing me off if you are playing and they shoot me through walls.
sorry didnt know
:-(
people have been acting as if ET is full of cheaters for over a year now (maybe even longer) but who gives a damn about all those low- retards that use cheats on public servers :S people dont cheat in skilled competitions, period.
you missed the point. i was just trying to say that it's even impossible to bust players in official matches. not everyone of those hackers might be that stupid like jLn or rocky and anyone else.
*edit* Refer to this post.
ET's lifetime ain't so long anymore. New players won't make it to the top anymore. Rather keep the competitive scene alive and not ban until you have clear evidence. (yes, I don't think ss.log in testing purpose is worth of ban and losing one player more.)
yes, CB has its policy and it must be followed, blaablaa. I just hope other leagues/cup hosters are not banning ppl for as ridiculous reasons as esl/cb may do. CB isn't your God, don't follow it in every case!
Definately not... But I find it's policies in this case far more agreeable than what you are saying. I find it ridiculous to let caught cheaters play freely as if nothing is wrong with what they did. ET is hardly so dead that some new players cannot replace a few banned cheaters.
He implies that ClanBase shouldn't have jurisdiction over public servers - they don't though. If you want to cheat on a public server then by all means go ahead and do so, just realise that doing so will result in you not being welcome to participate in ClanBase events. Personally I agree with ClanBase's policy, but that's neither here nor there, it's irrelevant to this point. The point is that ClanBase can make whatever rules they want, if you don't like them - play elsewhere!
but yes i know it was an ironical joke ...
too bad im not pro @ english so i can't write everything how i would want that to be understood [8<]
i said it over and over again but ths cheating thing is so fucking hyped in the ET community it's getting to a point where's its just utterly retarded.
these two players never cheated in official matches (YOU CANT KNOW THAT!!":1!:1:!: yes i can.) and they never will.
once a cheater, always a cheater.... oh come on we're talking about having some fun in a fucking online computer game
find your cloupon plz (or maybe some common sense?)
i lol'd :DDDDDDDDD
second maybe its fun but there are a different to have fun and archieve smth
on pub = fragwhore
in war/funwar = win
:>
and last but not least third
if u enjoy pubing do it and if some hacker with 360 aimfov comes u can kick him or leave the server but what do u want to do if u are forced to play against some hacker (if u know it for sure or just suggest it) coz u have a offi against him!!!
that 1 reason why i wont play activ anymore :> i wont be force to play against hackers :>
p.s.: but i enjoy to play against hackers some 3on3´s when they try to hide it well :o
edit: my comments have a lack of "having respect towards playing public" its imho nothing to respect on playing pub coz u can leave whenever u want :> when u dont like it anymore and u dont have to win
ET pub deserves the same respect as ET competition. Its just too sad it take CB half up to two yeas before they ban :'(
Not that I would care... Play more Urban Terror. ;)
Refering to this case: Could you really believe keran and shy that they will never ever use a hack in officials when they did so on a public server? Why did they try hax @ pub?? for fun? cant really see the fun, thats just retarded and they deserve a ban (imho).
Rules are rules, some of them are stupid, others are not. The point is you still have to follow all of them. No exceptions.
And until clanbase changes those rules everyone's going to get banned.
no!
if they wanted to "try" something, why didn't they play a 1v1 vs someone they know on a private server with pb off rather than being idiots on pub?
you won't spoil other ppls fun on pubs and you won't get caught by pb if you turn it off, however you will get a glimpse of how it works and curiosity will be satisfied
I am however convinced that banning for cheating on a pub server should be punished less than for competitive cheating.
Besides, it's only 6 months. If the ban goes in effect 1st of June they're back 1st of December.
And to answer Toss' question: if Night cheats on a pub, 6 months ban. Just to show that there are no exceptions to the rule, not even for the best.
And your other point, yeah, it might ruin the feel of the results/rankings. Who knows, maybe zP! could make it to second place or first, but the skill of the cheater shouldn't affect the decision.
My suggestion would be: Ban them for a few months after EC to punish them for making a mistake while playing around with hacks. But let them continue to play the cup. If they should have been banned for the cup, it should have happened two games ago already anyway, now it would just get even uglier.
It's unlikely (and impossible in the case of the LAN events they've participated in) that they have been using any external progs during their competitive games, so why should zP suffer also?
Would be overly harsh if zP suffer the same fate as Helix did and are made to forfeit games where all involved have been clean.
hack = ban.
"In-game cheating outside ClanBase: On a Public / Clan server: 6 month ban"
Don't know either of them personally, they sound like nice guys, but don't seem to be too smart.
They knew what the consequences were beforehand. That's really bottom line - they decided to use cheats on a public server, knowing full-well what would happen if they were caught. Assuming they're banned, it might make the next Joe Bloggs think twice before trying a cheat on a public server. Think of the opposite effect, suppose they weren't banned, it might inspire some would-be cheater to test a cheat on a public server or maybe more - 'if they got away with it, I might too'.
My biggest frustration with the ET community is the huge level of tolerance we seem to have for cheaters, it's a disgrace. Busted cheaters are still allowed to post here, happy as larry, why is that? This whole 'but he's cool on vent' attitude really needs to stop.
Welcome to ET111
So it doesn't matter who they are or where they cheated, the point is THAT they cheated. According to the rules, they should be banned. I hope (and think) Adacore, Bulld0g or whoever makes the call will keep those rules in mind and ban them.
They hacked and they should get banned, because we need a hard line against cheaters. If its ok that high skilled players cheat for fun, how can we say no to low skilled players running around with bots on pubs destroying the fun for everyone?
Ban them, their mistake, their responsibility.
Just couse of 1 reason.... it would be unfair against all others which got banned for public cheats aswell.
But to be fair they aint cheating in this eurocup so let them finish the eurocup and give them their 6 month brake after it.
in this case their team which trained as hard as all other dont need to suffer under it.
Bin auch 88 geboren!
In my opinion, they should get banned, since I have zero tolorance towards cheaters. That being said, the match was played should it be forfeited by old zP, replayed or should the old zP be allowed to continue playing the most prestigious online tournament in Enemy Territory?
I for one am glad I am not in the shoes of Adacore and Bulldog, for this is a F****** hard decision.
doesnt rly matter if you cheat @ public, or even jaymod servers, once a cheater always a cheater, and do they rly have any proofs that they were clean at offis played in past ? NOT
so decission shouldnt be so dificult imo
Really smart way to explain your innocense, really.
i remember kiazax telling me how he spoofed butchji and how much he'd been enjoying that newspost
*Getting kicked from their organisation is also what I think proves that they both, without a doubt, cheated.
before clanbase started to ban cheaters everybody (you too) blamed the admins for not banning busted ppl.
now they are merciless to any cheater and you blame them again just because it's some random "skilled" guy.
imo everybody should be punished for cheating. If it's keran or if it's killer.pl
6months ban for keran & shy + dropout from EC for zP
+ ban from crossfire, I've seen this banmessage: " You are banned from crossfire, reason: all cheaters get banned "
nevertheless, those germans should get ban just like everyone else.
why there's 'cheating in a public server' then in their c&a-profiles?
or you should not ban all the ppl, or you should. they keran and shy are also ET players, just as the rest .. they are not above someone else (even if they are good), judge them all the same (positive or negative)
conclusion, ban
Nice
Die kerel had private hax, wrom zou 'm dan alleen wallhack gebruiken als ge kunt aimen gelijk ne grote zonder da 't opvalt (voor de meesten :D)
But if you still believe scoot claiming he never cheated in a prac / whatever, you are either ignorant or you just don't wanna see the truth as he's a nice guy on vent / in RL / whatever...
hahaha made my fucking day
u got some priv hax for me? I was planning on using chaplja's new nexus.
they hacked, they should get banned, whats up to discuss?
österreich sollte ein vorbild für cb sein ;)
This is a real test for CB crew. If they decide not to ban them and leave the case as it was it's kinda weird and absurd. Rules shoudn't make a difference between EC player and OC 7 division player. CB loses all credibility and respect of many players, persons like me and my clan mates who like to bust cheaters and give them what they deserve. But if they decide ban them it's the right alternative for sure on CB's point of view but might hurt the scene and the skill level of EC.
My personal opinion is ban.
You punish a guy who cheats and gets an advantage over honest, normal players. It should be out of question whether he should be banned or not, but for how long he should be banned.
If they cheat, doesn't matter who and in which way of playing ET (pub, CB/ESL/whatever offi, prac, ...) they should get what they deserve...
PB itself doesn't care either if he cheats on a pub or in an official.
Ban them or change the rules, simple as
imo: no ban for keran&_shy... they have played @ lan, everybody saw that these 2 are skilled...
fu CB and your anti chat policy
go defend some more cheaters, there's plenty around so you won't be bored
and i never said that someone wanted keran's and shy bust.. for a cheater is easier to play with guid of well know player... coz almost everybody is thinking that top clans players are like gods or sth...
pbguid is 16-system number that u cant spoof[which is ofc not true]
but pbguid is pretty hard to spoof so your theory that any cheater would just spoof both guids of a known player just cos it's easier to fake a known player doesn't stand
plus that cheater is from germany, and I wonder if IP matches...
but if u have been on some math lessons + u have some knowlege of ET then u know that pbguid is easy to spoof... IF u know what to do..
and IP is not proof also... my dude's ip was on some nexus users list...
ask your provider is your ip stable or dynamic, and how many other useres have same ip like yours...
and btw, are keran and shy from poland?
ofc keran and shy arn't from pl, but it doesnt mean that ger provider dont do same thing
I can't imagine a human being stupid&retarded enough (even a polish one!!) to really think that so I guess u're a troll.
"omg cheater ban him ban him BURN THAT MOTHERFUCKER!!!"
They deserve a ban just like any other cheater.
Otherwise there is no justification for banning anyone any more. Why shouldn't they be banned? Because they are known? Thats not fair tbh. Because they played on a lan? That doesn't proof much tbh.
Don't misunderstand me, i don't think they have ever tried a cheat in any competitive match, still there's no other possibility than banning them, if ET as a competitive game itself and CB wants to be taken seriously.
There's no matter if the cheater is Night or someone else, having a name mustn't change a thing. If they have cheated and got busted, they should bear the consequences.
idiotic...
If i get it right u want to give the 2 yermans some kinda political invulnerabilty.
u are getting it wrong
THEY ARE HIGH SKILED LETS THINK OVER AND OVER AND OVER ON IT MAYBE WE PUNISH THEM LESS.
so many posts journals question interwies on somthing so clear as a6months ban from cb.
raz got it and survived.
give them 2.
weeks before that match against Impact they got busted and admitted that they "tried out" the hacks.
so CB should have react way earlier with a simple 6 month ban for both
Did they cheat?
Yes
Do we ban for cheating?
Yes
Did it happen 2 years ago?
no
Public or Official?
Public = 6 months
Difficult decission? I even fail to see the reason of this collumn. They cheated. They will get a ban.
What would be far more interesting is you finishing part 3 of your quakewars story... :[
But I've got also another question. Should butcjhi and me get banned for that we played officials with cheaters, although we knew it? I knew that
Although it sounds laughable, but I have and had no bad conscience as I am 32494293240 per cent sure that he doesn't cheat and just tried it as I am playing with him together since over 2 years. Otherwise, if somebody would tell me the same story about someone else I would just laugh about.
P.S.: I think
if onyone ever has cheated on anywhere=he is cheater
But I've got also another question. Should butcjhi and me get banned for that we played officials with cheaters, although we knew it? I knew that kokispoika was busted for etpub hax, although I've played officials with him till he got banned.
Although it sounds laughable, but I have and had no bad conscience as I am 32494293240 per cent sure that he doesn't cheat and just tried it as I am playing with him together since over 2 years. Otherwise, if somebody would tell me the same story about someone else I would just laugh about.
P.S.: I think Night cheated and tosspot know that. He just wants to test whether the community is already ready for the scandal!
Just accept that they got real skill aswell moron.
I fail to understand how this is a hard decision, as it is no diffrent from the 'razz case'
First of all you all know that I’m no cheater (I proofed often enough etc). I think it's funny that everybody is so excited now cause there are quite a lot guys with this red yawn thing and similar pbbans (and no one of them got banned anywhere) but ye its zP and we are more famous blabla but even more funny are those who think I’m really cheating with some kind of private bot. I never cheated anywhere but its true and I can’t deny that there was this ss.log thing in my etfolder (believe it or not I didn’t even play on any public server with cheats even if I would I can’t understand where the big deal is to test a public hack and there are public hacks with this ss.log thingy but this is another problem and there are different point of views). I have to admit that there was a hack on my pc, that it was my fault and to own a hack but the most stupid thing was that I was too stupid to delete every single file. [The reason why I had this hack was to go on a no pb server check where the hit boxes are when you jump etc..I know now that it’s possible to check this on a pretty much easier way but I thought this would be the only way and for me this was no cheating.] I can’t force you to believe me and I actually don’t care if you do it but this is how it happed and tbh it wouldn’t be fair to ban me for this cause no one got banned for such a thing.
edit:these are the things i know..they might be wrong (e.g this ban stuff sry2u just dont care about that part) and i dont care about this so do and think what ever you want !
I would love to read your examples.
If they make the exception on you every cheater can say i only got the hack to test the hit boxes like you.
Did you dld and used a cheat for what ever reason?
Do the cb rules say that using a cheat where ever will result in a ban?
having a hack in your etfolder doesnt mean you used it.
edit: and if you rly want the comparison, the one you gave is wrong.
having the gun in home and having the body of dead person killed by a bullet of the same calibre your gun has + your bullet has signs on it that someone used it not long ago + gunpowder on your hands + blood stain (same type as deadman's blood) on your shirt, means you killed him
I have to say though that you would probably be better off if you had not commented at all. This is just a ridiculous excuse, even if it's true. b_realhead was officially introduced almost 2 years ago and anybody could've told you that. There were also tons of hitbox journals around that time where you could've easily picked up that the hitboxes were in fact very much borked in the early etpro releases.
yep the only thing u should get bannd is that u wasnt smart enough to delete the hack completly :P
doesn't matter what he did with it.
oh im gonna read it anyway, because: so many replies, must be interesting!
Everyone seems to be assuming it's some "judgement call" as to whether CB ET bans them - it's not really anything like that.
Another thing in wars is, of course, that you know who you're going to play before you play them. You look for a game, if someone you've played in the past who cheated wants a game, you don't have to play them. Conversely it's easy to find opponents with fair reputations who you know won't be cheating. On publics anyone can join, by their very nature, so no matter where you go or who is playing you can never guarantee anything.
Also, a point that was raised previously, on public you have all these "low- nonames", the noobies of the scene, but what most of you seem to forget is that these noobs are the players of the future. If these players come up against cheaters who have aim and gamesense (ie wallhack) that the noobs just think is impossible, they may well either give up on the game or look for cheats themselves in order to compete. Think about what that does to the future community and the number and quality of players who are then picked up into lowskill clans from publics, joining the competetive scene?
Only downside of this whole argument is that we're about 4 years too late.
But still. if u test a cheat on public, no matter if ur nick is night and ur from estonia, or its someone unknown from sweden, it should still be a ban.
These guys are known players, and yes they perform at lan etc. But the decision they made was unfortunately the wrong decision when they tested the cheat. 6 months ban if thats the policy.
If the policy was 12 months ban, i would say 12 months ban. And if the policy was lifetime ban. I would say lifetime ban.
Sorry but thats just how it is. If u cheat, u get banned. No matter if ur the president of the USA or just a lousy ambassador in Iraq.
when ? how? what game?
im sorry for these both guys as well as for some other players who get a ban, but rules are rules.
The question here should be, what's the best for the ET community and what is the most just decision. This isn't the Inquisition after all. ;)
no one is an exeption for rulez not keran and shy and neigther fost and other busted ones
i know you what them banned too :o) but i like winding you up @_@
btw i got banned from every thing... every cup every league
they got only banned from esl
nice admins :)
btw i dont want to say u should unbann me... just that u should bann them too :o
i mean why would they even want to. they are skilled enough without it. so whatever reason they come forward with they still tried it and should suffer the concequences.
* Trace of cheat (e.g. variable setting)
You can read the comment here.
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where?? :(
_shy even played on more LANs than keran, but smaller local german LANs, meet him a few times at Enlarged LAN etc.
nur lustiger vielleicht
kackspast :>>>>>
btw in the past there played good and many teams et and rtcw
piirinmestaruuskisat olis joku random pracci ja public ku juokset muuten vaa jossai metässä
and it sucks that the rules apply to outside CB
but if the article is accurate about their ability to prove their merit over and over, then in 6 months there should be no problem for them to become part of another active team
this guy got 12month ban by multihack and he got the same ss.log warning @ yawn like keran :)
Cheaters should be shunned to discourage others from cheating. If people treat it as no big deal when a top player cheats, then players at all levels will think it is no big deal. Ban them, treat them like the scumbags they have shown themselves to be. Cheats destroy the game, whether on publics or in official matches. The public scene feeds the comp scene, if one dies, the other is likely to die as well. If you enjoy the game, you shouldn't tolerate them anywhere.
The rules are clear. If you commit the crime, you do the time. That should apply equally to everyone.
But hey, this is the community that still gives the time of day to an ex-clanbase admin who admitted *paying* for cheats. Bad enough to cheat, far worse to fund those who are dedicated to destroying the game we enjoy.
Okay a couple issues since you haven't seemed to deal with any real issues in your life yet. Cheating is bad, yes. I class public cheating in the same category as under age drinking and drug use since you might understand real life paralells better. Yeah its bad per say, but people still do it and most people still at some point have done it. Gaming by definition isn't competitive. Just because your playing against another human doesn't mean you want to win, sometimes you play solely for entertainment, to cure boredom or for social interaction. You take some of this way too seriously to be honest. I was curious and wanted to see what it was like so me using some brains, decided to hack in a game which wasn't my main game where the "damage" was nothing (cod2 / non pb public server) which seems to go against what you implied about me; that I 'm somehow destroying ET by paying for cheats.
People will create cheats no matter what, but you chose to reward them from it. Cheats extending the life of the game such obvious horseshit that it doesn't warrant a response. I can think of many gaming communities that were seriously damaged by cheating.
Begone, scumbag.
Gaming communities are composed of the players playing them. Once they are destroyed, even the cheaters have to move on. You may not be able to think of any which were destroyed by cheating, but that just shows your ignorance or denial.
Spoken like a true scumbag.
Of course I'm not saying that cheating alone completely destroys a game over night, but it very clearly contributes. This is all rather obvious, but I'm sure you'll find some way to completely miss the point.
lol.
x2 to you2
Cheats don't destroy the game, in fact I would go as far as to say that they lengthen the time that some people spend playing the game. Name me 1 person or even 1 game that has died solely on cheating related issues.
Cheats/cheaters do destroy the will for some honest players in any game and makes them quit so yea i would agree it kills some part of the game but not one game is dead becose of cheats/cheters.
Cheating is bad, yes. I class public cheating in the same category as under age drinking and drug use since you might understand real life paralells better. Yeah its bad per say, but people still do it and most people still at some point have done it. Gaming by definition isn't competitive. Just because your playing against another human doesn't mean you want to win, sometimes you play solely for entertainment, to cure boredom or for social interaction.
Of all the stupid examples you realy had to use the most stupid one did you?
Does your drinking or using drugs realy hurts or does anything bad to me dont think it does.
Does your cheating against me afect me having fun i think it does so there isnt any what so ever reason for your example.
And for the entertainment/bordom part you are kiding me right?
Even those guys who dont give a fuck about anything at all dont like to be raped by cheaters.
Whats to stop me, being drunk and/or under the influence of drugs ruining your night out by beating up one of your mates etc that type of thing ? The entertainment/boredom part if a parallel because it works for both clean players and cheaters. I only find myself playing mixes but the majority of the time I'm on public and there is always a cheater on these days, and to be honest it doesn't bother me one bit.
Arguing such issues is pointless, since there will always be people who think cheating isn't that big of a deal (ie. the "internets" attitude) and people who think the opposite. Convincing or reaching an agreement with the other group is hopeless. That's where rules come in, which is really the simplest way that this column can be answered: Clanbase bans these two players, and punishes the team as per their rules. At some point someone has to take control and do something or nothing at all will be done, ultimately it's up to Clanbase to manage their own league.
Reyalp>fucktard
1. cheating on a pub leads to a ban of 6 months
2. keran and shy cheat on a pub
3. keran and shy get a ban of 6 months
Once again Dr.Phil has solved a case his retarded fellow americans (in this case xfire users instead of americans) couldnt handle
they may be lan-proven & fame & pro & whatsofuckingever but that doesnt change the fact that they broke rules
Doesnt Matter Who You Are!
If cb dont ban them -> everybody can test hax in puplic server without ban -> nobody doesnt play anymore there -> not funny
You can argue that it's a stupid rule (and I would disagree), but as long as it's there it should be enforced. Start making exceptions and you lose all credibility.
The fact that these are players that are "playing very well" without cheats only makes their act more stupid, so call it a 6 month ban for stupidity if that makes you feel better.
i find it amusing, that's all :)
only clanbase has to lose with a biased judgement here... it's their credibility as an honest competition organization that is in stake here.
if they f*ck it up who will trust them again to play any competition?
"play devils advocate"
"I'm not interested in defending them, simply highlighting the difficulty of the decision ahead."
"no I'm not writing this with any vested interest in their success"
"personally I will understand which one they make"
So which is it? Blind that you missed these 4 statements that clearly show I want to do nothing "this time", or retarded for thinking that I would want to be involved in this decision process when I title the column "I dont envy".
The retard comment is looking more and more justified every time you reply
your the retard if you see this different
Unless you know something I dont, mize hasnt attended anywhere near the amount of events in ET as these two, but did drop out of CPC.
The QUESTION raised, not opinion put forward, is whether that counts for anything. The answer from the replies at least is no it dosent.
The fact someone like you is involved in the cheatbusting community dosent fill me with confidence.
No need to argue: brake the rules --> bear the consequences.
Shouldn´t be an offence towards your column as it was a nice read. :>
My question is.. what is CHEATING ? Isn't it people using external software which gives them an unfair advantage compared to other players? If so... there are several players making use of it, i can tell. Although my question is .. which programms do u refer to cheating?
In my eyes the tweaks/hacks Razz used on a sudden moment is a Cheat. Improving mouseperformance by external programms or simple mousesoftware ain't cheating, eventhough ur getting an (unfair) advantage to ur opponent in some kind of way. Another example is software to increase the performance of ur connection. There is a way to get a more stable ping etc. by increasing traffic. See it as pinging 100 times a second instead of pinging 10 times a second. I wouldn't directly say it's cheating but once again u gain an unfair advantage... When do u cross the line ?
See gaming as F1 racing, You have to be a good driver in order to compete (personal skills). The richer teams, with the better cars clearly have an advantage (good computers etc.), they'r simply faster (eventhough that doesn't mean they'll always win). They'r also (most of the time) the teams with more "tech know-how" balancing on what's allowed with adjustments.. and what's not.
And i think so far CB is doing a pretty good job, just interfere when *tweakers* go too far
Oh and make the decision fast, maybe get Impact back already the longer you leave it the more it hurts the EC
they lost vs clean players. the match was fair, without any hax.
till the verdict everybody is clean :)
but ye, what rezzie says its true. they should get 0-1 with impact (after the verdict)
I see this as yet another stupid move by two (highskilled) players who just wanted to "try it out" or something. Although i dont really know what they wanted (maybe it's said already but i havn't read everything), i just want to say that they must be incredibly dumb to throw away something they've worked "hard" for.
Conclusion: they should be treated just like everyone else and not be an exception because they sort of "proven" themselves by attending at a lan event. They knew the consequences if they would get caught and, sorry for them, they got busted.
2nd point of the column: if someone is highskill, can he hack legally?
other thing is that Night (who is, i believe, wise person) wouldnt cheat. so such comparison is just an easy trick imo. He may be best player in the world and I may be a fanboi but if he did such thing, that means he doesnt deserve to have a fanboy or any title. but since hacking on ffa isnt allowed (yet), they are bad boys and should be banned. no matter who: keran or Estonian, no matter. i wouldnt even say "too bad but he has to be banned". i would just say "too bad but he has to be banned"
nice writing though
If e-sports wants to be taken serious, this isn't even a discussion. If a professional soccer player got caught in a drug-control in off-season, during a friendly game(or training or wherever he might get tested), he would be banned.
Though there's a lot of aspects on this, where you can argue back and forth, the only right thing would be to ban cheaters, no matter what.
when razz where busted hx was removed from EC, but this was group stage...
pro5 is after 2 playoffs matches... its impossible to remove them, and banning keran and shy will probably force pro5 to dropout, which is also impossible imo[wtf with loosers bracket?]...
so start your whine efter EC :P
comparing keran, shy & Night ---> ROFL LOL OMG
HUY HUY HUY
night is not a retard so he won't cheat ...
not only nothing can excuse a cheater, but here like you say they are famous skilled guys, they want it or not they are to some level an exemple for low players.
you re a smart guy toss, you can t put aside the consequences of a favor treatment on the community's vision of justice. and it has nothing to do with how cool or great those guys are. when you cheat you take a chance, they too knew that.
I don't say anything about should they get banned anyway
pub noobs are the future's competition players
I lolled. I'm sure there will be at least 5 more ET EC. Read my lips.
Nah, they are 2 of ET's finest players, the player you look up to when you start youre competif gaming.. the players from who you want the config, they only lost alot of fans with their mistake.
But plz, just let them play on lans.. =)
And I am trying to be neutral because gifty is a great friend.
It's your fault if you choose to hack whether it be on a public or a clanwar, you suffer the consequences.
When I hacked in RTCW, it was not in a clanwar, only on jolt 3 public server but yet I was banned for a year or something and my reputation was the worst ever, clans didn't want to play with or against me, etc.
Everyone else should be treated the same.
What, because they're known players, they should get away with it ..? That's not setting the right example at all.
Well doesn't matter, my intentions were to use it in scrims if it wasn't detected anyway :}