Wolfenstein - Enemy Territory

Crevasse_b3 Released

by Nellie • 9 Nov 2006, 08:17 • News
Crevasse b2 has featured heavily recently in various competitions, and following feedback in a Crossfire poll Australia Dersaidin has released an updated Crevasse_b3.

Overwhelmingly winning with 252 votes (38.1%) was to change the final stage objective from grenadable in _b2 to a doc run - which has been implemented.

Major changes include:

- Final objective is now a doc run. Transmitter near axis spawn.
- Axis can no longer boost into the room at the bottom of the elevator shafts.
- Allies can no longer TK-revive over the cage to get to the second phase.

For more information on the changes, see the readme.

This latest version will be used in the current ESL season. As ever Australia Dersaidin is looking for constructive feedback, be it positive or negative.

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Comments
93
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phobeus 9 Nov 2006, 08:19
shitmap forever
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Adacore 9 Nov 2006, 13:02
I don't think that counts as constructive feedback, fobje ;)
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phobeus 9 Nov 2006, 15:10
shit map not more
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Blaz3n 9 Nov 2006, 08:26
Nice changes, now I <3 the map.
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Reky 9 Nov 2006, 12:40
ofc you love the map , you're canadian
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huumeantti 9 Nov 2006, 08:43
its "ok" i guess...
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blaze 9 Nov 2006, 09:02
not a nother map i need to learn plz xD
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Dersaidin 9 Nov 2006, 09:04
I might add that if you still dont like it after these changes, I might just scrap it and start something new.
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Darky 9 Nov 2006, 13:14
First of all, thx for your work - we really need some good new maps.

If you keep working on maps then my little "hint" would be - take a look at special delivery2, the concept of the map. If it wouldnt depend that much on the spawntime then it would probably be the best map of them all. Its full of action and close combat, it forces teams to split up the defense and the offense, requires Information and the docs are on the run for like 60-70% of the whole game, which makes the games there really exciting. Something similar to special delivery 2 with a solution for the spawntimes would just cause heart attacks for the spectators during a good game.

greets and good luck
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 13:16
du magst sie doch nur weil du an den doorcontrolz so geruled hast auf der qcon :P
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Adacore 9 Nov 2006, 14:26
I have three problems with Delivery, although they're mostly personal opinion things:

1 - The majority of the map is internal, so the tactical depth seen in the use of airstrikes, artillery, etc is missing.
2 - The stages can be finished very quickly, which isn't in itself a problem, but the map only has two stages, which is too few imo, so games can be over too soon.
3 - A point that's not actually that relevant to Delivery, but is to other maps: I know it's standard in oldschool RTCW style, but I don't like the fact that the defending team can 'reset' the map to first stage by retaking the flag on some maps. On delivery the map is offensively biased enough that this isn't a massive problem, but on other maps it's just plain annoying imho.
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 16:41
imho recaptures are exciting :) maybe a opportunity 4 the defender but still exciting :P

and the indoor thing of delivery i have to agree but maybe thats the point why someone like this map coz less arti + airstrike spam!!! ( i prefer LT so i dislike the map 2 and i am noob with nades so i hate the map coz nades are a huge tactical part of this map :)
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Decade 9 Nov 2006, 10:37
Ok you removed all of the interesting parts of the map, congratulations.
Now this seems the most uninspired map ever. The final objective was fun and original; the strategy of defending the cp as axis and shoot the allies as they jump in the water was a "broken-feeling" strategy, but very interesting to use (and find counter-strategies) and definitely not unbeatable; jumping over the barbedwire didn't break the map either since it's impossible to do it with people shooting from the windows. I hoped that at least some of these elements would stay in the final version. :(
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Dersaidin 9 Nov 2006, 10:42
The boost up to the room at the bottom of the elevators, and the boost over the cage were unintended exploits.

The grenadeable objective was removed by popular demand :/
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chosen 9 Nov 2006, 10:44
u should ignore some comments ;)
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overdrive 9 Nov 2006, 10:52
whine always wins in ET.
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Decade 9 Nov 2006, 10:58
By the way, I made a quick run in the empty map and it looks like it's still possible to boost inside the cp room as axis, by jumping from the shoulders of a teammate who is standing on the antitank gun, the same way as you jump inside the west wall in supply from the shoulders of a teammate standing on the rock. This was possible in previous versions (and a quicker way than using the slidy rock under the wall crack), if you didn't change the position of the antitank gun it's still possible

When I'm back home I'll try it with a teammate and post a demo
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Decade 9 Nov 2006, 11:05
The concept of "fixing" that part of the map by preventing the axis from going up is flawed. Imagine if the allies players barely manage to deliver the keycard in a suicide rush, while getting chased by the whole axis team; the door opens, all the allies are dead, all the axis are alive: they will jump in the water and wait for the allies there. This already happened to my team. Instead of limiting the axis movement, try to make the descent in the lower room more attackable imo
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Adacore 9 Nov 2006, 13:05
As Nellies says/implies, if this happens the Axis can only get people there once, and it's very hard to deliberately plan. With the boost strategy you can get your entire team up there and I imagine (haven't tested, but guessing) if you skipped the first stage and instead set positions around the elevators it would be practically impossible for the allies to get through.
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Decade 9 Nov 2006, 13:52
Indeed, that was my point: now it's hard to deliberately plan, and if it just happens, the allies are screwed. A map where some random and unusual circumstance can screw one of the teams is not a good map, is it?
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Adacore 9 Nov 2006, 13:55
No, but you can ask the question is it random? Maybe if the attacking team knows about the possibilty (ie has map knowledge) they will be able to prevent it, in which case it's no longer luck - it's another skill element.
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Nellie 9 Nov 2006, 13:59
It's something the allies can counter, you've got 3 exits & once they're gibbed that's it.

Or do you mean it's hard for axis to deliberately plan? It's lucky if they get there & you improvise to capitalise on it - which is a major part of ET. Doesn't stop you having set positions for the next stage.

Will wait to see how it plays :o)
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Adacore 9 Nov 2006, 15:22
I think countering it if it happens with a full team of 6 axis would be very, very hard. One guy watches the vent, then the others can spam nades at the elevators and shoot anyone who drops down. Trying to shoot back while falling/on a ladder/in the water is practically impossible, and it's a big enough area that a panzer or rifle would be reasonably ineffectual.
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Nellie 9 Nov 2006, 15:28
Sure it's attritional, might take an extra spawn. But what's the probability of all 6 getting down there?

Guess the best fix would be replacing the water pit with a ladder ala et_beach - needs playing first to see if it's practical problem.
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Decade 9 Nov 2006, 16:33
a counterstrategy could be to run 4 engineers with rifle (they have no spread penalization when tthey shoot from climbing a ladder afaik) , never tested :P
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shpeKje 9 Nov 2006, 11:14
1) too much objectives in one map
2) walls with "windows" in the room with docs are bit strange
3) eng should be able to repair gun on one powerbar

thats all :P
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Nellie 9 Nov 2006, 11:16
1) There's 4 objectives - that's average.
2) Why waste bullets shooting out the windows?
3) Makes it too easy
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Raged 9 Nov 2006, 11:58
well said, but i don't agree with the making of this map... just started praccing it with clans but there is too many maps coming out at once imho.
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shpeKje 9 Nov 2006, 14:51
1) ok :)
2) boxes or some other things will be better imo
3) this will make this map faster (better to ettv watchers :)
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swine 10 Nov 2006, 08:33
faster != better
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breezy 9 Nov 2006, 11:32
nice work
:)
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Raged 9 Nov 2006, 11:48
SCRAP!!!

Please, stop bringing out so many maps. Every time a clan learns and practises a map there's a brand new one; and usually another BETA or another version.
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Dreamweaver 9 Nov 2006, 17:50
its the same map, just changed a little
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twidi 9 Nov 2006, 11:49
just forget about this map already...
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omraJ 9 Nov 2006, 12:04
This map really sucks hard
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frozz. 9 Nov 2006, 12:53
This map sux, make some mape like oasis instead.
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kenij 9 Nov 2006, 12:55
It's great when someone brings out new maps...
I'm not really into it but that's ok. I hope final version will be the best one...
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Adacore 9 Nov 2006, 13:06
I'm really sorry Ders, but I don't personally like the map. It has a couple of interesting concepts, and I'd definitely keep the overall layout of (some of) the individual areas in mind for future use - the first stage and b2 final stage were very interesting - but the map as a whole just doesn't seem to 'fit' for me.
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Echo 9 Nov 2006, 14:00
the map is running at fdnl

195.238.74.168:27960
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Yossarian 9 Nov 2006, 14:31
quality map, but i don't like it :|
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blushing_bride 9 Nov 2006, 15:12
You can always count on members of the ET competitive community to give you well thought out and constructive feedback.
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Adacore 9 Nov 2006, 15:23
I believe you can. Obviously the majority of feedback isn't constructive, but there is some. Just ignore the 'shitmap' and 'greatmap' comments and work with the comments with actual suggestions/questions...
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hoho 9 Nov 2006, 15:21
shitmap
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Reatard 9 Nov 2006, 15:36
Waiting for Crevasse_b7d or so. Or Crevasse_final.
Ps. Need Ip&pass to test this somewhere.
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 16:20
Havent tried it yet, but seems you fixed only minor things, so sorry, this map was a nice try, but it just isnt good enough. apart from feeling strange, the objectives seem to easy and its way to much spam depended. lotto remains a huge part. axis never get a chance to set up a defence. its just very complicated and strange, spam comes from everywhere.

I'd say give it another go, take another close look to maps like braun and sd and you will make a nice map.

But still, the effort is very much apreciated!
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zerender 9 Nov 2006, 16:36
i would like to see a new map in radarstyle
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 16:55
revive cathedral imo!
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 16:57
introduce village :)
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 17:27
doesnt work in ET (rifle, mines, you name it)
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 17:29
yeah but we can change this map 2 like all others to set the amout of mines to 0 then its playable i think rifle sucks in every map :)
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 17:53
yeah yeah, but like a wise man said: "revive cathedral imo!". that map had so much potential, and it looks great. not a complete mess like crevasse or something. i dont think reviving old rtcw maps is the best we could do. o yeah, railgun and battery should be given another go.
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 18:00
rofl rail and battery sucks hard imho and i like to throw airstrikes and spam artilerie so i am not a friend of cathedral!!!
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 18:03
i think the adjusted railgun would be a real improvement, besides config back then was completely different. Also for battery, no mines and mortar would greatly improve it. perhaps an slightly improved sw_ version would make this maps perfect imo.

cathedral i always liked, and i thought it was quite populair. perhaps if the maker would improve it a little to the players need it could also be great.
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 18:07
i dislike railgun since i played it the first time and i guess we cant change so much that i would enjoy :P (not only the textures more the objectiv)

and ur point 4 cathedral i can use 4 village 2 :P
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 18:16
whatever, we both agree that we dont like crevasse ?
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 18:18
dont played the final version yet but the last versions sucks in my humble opinion
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 18:21
only minor changes, except for the final objective.
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 18:22
its smth like blind suicide rushing the whole map imho
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FrEak187 9 Nov 2006, 18:17
yes would be cool
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Uteoz 10 Nov 2006, 16:30
I'd like to see one too :)

Because the map has 2 objectives located
far from each other, it opens much more
options with attacking and defending...

Looking forward to see a radar-based map some day :-/
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ENSJQM 9 Nov 2006, 16:42
I like it, not as good as adlernest (there isn't any better map maps than adler)

Keep up working
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zerender 9 Nov 2006, 17:12
so this its becoming more and more like adlernest, and we dont need 2 adlernests
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m!das 9 Nov 2006, 17:12
did we need 1 adlernest?
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Dreamweaver 9 Nov 2006, 17:57
and we dont need 2 radars, following your logic
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ph4ge 9 Nov 2006, 18:21
you do need 2 radars, if you got only one you wont win :<
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webbie 9 Nov 2006, 17:39
we need to refresh maplists.. it's sad to see oasis / goldrush in cups - always the same, boooring
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nightm4re 9 Nov 2006, 18:30
Honestly i really like the previous incarnations, will try this one out later today. Its a fun map to play and works when we can only muster up a 2v2, still have many fun games on it.

I was shocked enough at the change from b1 to b2, this is another big one.. and I thought the way the ramp changed in adler was enough..

Anyway Dersaidin thanks for all your hard work, I'm sorry it's not so well received here, I really enjoy it. Keep it up please!
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Nubiks 9 Nov 2006, 18:48
cervasse should be banned
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Immortal 9 Nov 2006, 19:00
shitmap,just forget that map pls
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kenij 9 Nov 2006, 19:02
and u want to play supply,braundorf, oasis, rush, radar, adler forever????
u suck!
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webbie 9 Nov 2006, 19:12
yea new maps > old
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Immortal 9 Nov 2006, 19:36
i want new maps,but this one sux
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risee 9 Nov 2006, 23:47
We need more maps like goldrush or radar and less docrun-maps imo. Those maps are (still) awesome because they require teamplay and they usually can't be finished within 2min. Most of the new maps just lack clear stages and are consequently too luck-based (braun, adler, frost...). And for some reason most of them are inside-only so airstrikes, artillerys etc are completely redundant. I'd really like to see a map like radar, grush or even supply being realized again.
still n1 work, keep it up.
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Nellie 10 Nov 2006, 13:21
Radar is a docrun map:o
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risee 10 Nov 2006, 14:43
There are docs in radar? :D
Nah i know what you mean. But still radar is completely different to those "real" docrun-maps like adler or frost. It's not luckbased at all and its one of the few well-balanced maps, from a fast time to fullhold everything is possible. radar contains a lot of possibilities to both atttackers and defenders, teamplay is essential on it. And tactical elements like arty/airstrikes have not just been taken away from the map.
Because of all these points maps like radar and sw_grush are still the best maps avi atm.
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nage 10 Nov 2006, 06:52
blabla :D radar > *
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