Nothing to do, we are all going to bankrupt. Sooner or later.
Or just change the society system. Get rid of money-->get rid of problems. How to do it? Don't ask me.
the lattern only because the banks are going to lose one hell of an amount of money if you ditch those countries... and the countries those banks are situated in 'have to' save those banks.
not good in a 'moral' point of view maybe, but still very good considering economy. (for the winning side only obviously)
but has a positive economical effect for the losing party too. they get rid of any depts. of any social standards too most likely but see it as a new beginning, economy rockets up after any way (true, it hits rock bottom first...but it rises steeply) :P
take germany for example. our economy was at it's lowest at the end of ww2 (practically because everything was being bombed). and look how it evolved until today, it's at it's highest... ever
(that line was not to be taken seriously. it was meant to mock economics itself. an uprise trend is always preferable, and thats what you have after you reach zero, there's no other way.)
do not care - let germany have it's own currency again and switch all jobs from production and sales into service providers and import again - case closed :P
but that would be the only possible solution for germany to even get out of the euro again and yet not have a major inclination in it's economic system IMO (that it is not realisable, since you won't get everyone within a day to switch jobs and do something else (and be successful at it) is for certain) :DD
:D
the major upcoming problem of leavin euro and getting a new own currency would rather be the upward revaluation of this currency.. in fact we could import things pretty cheap. but we are mainly an export nation - tho exporting goods would become drastically more expensive for other countries, which in the end will lead to a shrinking economy here :/
basically everything is shit ;D seems like there has to be found a way to solve the problems as good as possible in this system we are currently running in :S
yes - currently we depend on exports, well thats why i said - let's switch back to import (having the upward revaluation of our current currency in mind) and switch all export related jobs to import and service providing(since that could still be somewhat exported^^)...but yes, not a real option I'm afraid
but neither is war, I'm sorry, at least not for 'us'. we'd get smashed big times. just let the US and...china for example have war. might have a positive effect not on national but on world economy at least maybe :P
basically the idea aint that bad.. mercedes and audi for every yerman :-D and the rest can become farmers :XD
and ye we prolly would get rolled hard by bangladesh or any other poor country in the world ^^
yea well, low $ results in a high €, but only as long as they use the $ for international trades. as soon as they dump it it shouldn't have any impact on us anymore (IF there is one to substitude for the lack of goods and services...and to buy ours)
Well, what can i say, america is america, its basically a country with two worlds living in it, one is megapoor which they hide, and the another megarich side lives in hollywood and get ridiculously much money for doing nothing
Because most of that debt is towards their own citizens which means the money stays within the country. There's not a flow of money out of the country to foreign investors unlike Greece. If needed, Japan can increase taxes if the problem becomes precarious. Also, because most of the debt is in domestic hands, foreigners don't have a big impact in speculating against it.
Secondly, Japan has a very low private debt (the japanese people barely have any personal debt) which means they can more easily handle a higher public debt ratio.
Thirdly, Japan's economy is in a better shape (allthough not that great either) then Greece, Italy, Portugal or Ireland.
And last but not least, Japan has a very big economy which means the tax base is much larger then Greece or Portugal. If they get in trouble, they can more easily raise taxes to fulfil their financial obligations (eg. finance their debt).
How can a state have a debt toward their own citizien when the debt it's of all the citiziens?
japan hasn't a very low private debt to me,italian private debt it's lower then japan.
guess he means japanese obligations are more related to japanes banks and donors. so most credits are are given and paid from japan in japan. besides that greece has most of its olbigations on foreign banks or creditors.
private debts are another story.
Japan (the government that is) has a public debt of 225% so let's say a 10 trillion $ public debt. Because japanese save a lot, they buy japanese bunds. As far as I know, a huge majority of those bunds (90%??) are in japanese hands. Basically the government has 10 trillion $ debt which is in the hands of the japanese people themselves.
Italy has one of the lowest levels of private debt in the west but Japan aswell has a quite low private debt compared to the rest of the western world (indeed not as low as Italy afaik).
Italians save a lot too, probably the most in europe. Italians have owned homes more then in other states in europe. Why no care about private debt? for example UK have a really big private debt.
Because a dozens of economic paramters are used, not only public debt and/or private debt.
The problem for Italy is the lack of growth. Italy's economy grew at the lowest pace of all EU members in the last 10 years. Without growth, you can't pay down your debt and your debt burden becomes too big. Also, reforms in the labour market are urgently needed in Italy. Without these, economic growth will be even harder to achieve especially with the population becoming older, costs will increase, etc...
The fact is Italy has the 2nd highest public debt (120%) in the EU, a deficit of 4,5% which means Italy's debt becomes bigger every year. Add in the fact that Italy barely grows at all, you know why investors are questioning Italy's ability to pay down their debt. Also, Italy has a quite high tax rate alreaydy so it's harder to raise taxes even more which means there's less room to get money from the citizens to pay for the increasing debt.
The difference with the UK is that the UK has a growing economy, public debt is a lot lower (80%) then Italy's and they have more room to increase taxes, have a more dynamic economy,etc... but yes the UK has it's problems aswell, just not enough for investors to question their ability to pay down their debt.
The € was fundamentally flawed from the beginning as there were no mechanisms put in place to sustain or help individual countries that got into trouble.
A single interest rate across hugely divergent economies as well as population sizes proved a disaster for Ireland in particular.
It allowed a corrupt government(almost Berlusconi levels of corruption) to allow income tax revenues to fall below what was needed and replace that revenue with stamp duty on new houses, along with insane tax breaks for developers. When the inevitable construction crash came, well we all know what happened then.
with germany being one of the biggest countries of the € zone i wonder how you can wonder about the lack of such mechanisms such as saving 'declining' countries. it surves the purpose why "we" are in the € in the first place
nono, bad economics in the euro zone keeps the euro low, which is good for exports, that's why 'we' are up for it, that's what we do for a living
(well not I, but germany)
Ask the motherfucking rating agencies to stop downgrading the mark of Greece, Spain, etc. They are just speculating and making the things going even worse...
Oh well, who gives a shit anyway?
My country went bankrupt, and it's almost chaos everywhere, still, I'm a rich sob and I don't give a flying fuck.
Unless you are poor like your government, I don't see why you should care.
So you don't care about rising taxes? I see your only 17 so you don't care if you don't find a job and if you find one, you don't care you'll earn less and/or pay higher taxes on it? You say your rich, maybe the portuguese government will create a wealth tax, who knows? It's more likely to happen in a country that is broke then in a wealthy country :)
If you have a few 100k euro or a few million, no, you shouldn't have a problem but otherwise I think you should :)
Yes and that's why you are not outside spending your money, going to the beach, getting some drinks and chicks instead you spam here on crossfire, awesome way of being a rich guy :)
1) I don't go to the beach because I'm a nigger, don't need to get tanned.
2)I'm very healthy, I don't drink alcohol.
3)I'm gay, don't need chicks.
4) How am I spending money by spamming cf?
there is salary overcharge over all europe during too many years, while in china exports liek a bitch, the piigs can go out of euro but they import you know?
like pumu already said, it is just another social order failing... like communism or monarchism did ... not capitalism is going down imo.
upcoming social order for the next few decades will be some environmental saving shit or something like that imo... those are the last breaths of capitalism.
Or just change the society system. Get rid of money-->get rid of problems. How to do it? Don't ask me.
I'm in.
boem g5'd
war is never good imo. !
but has a positive economical effect for the losing party too. they get rid of any depts. of any social standards too most likely but see it as a new beginning, economy rockets up after any way (true, it hits rock bottom first...but it rises steeply) :P
proof it on countries who lost wars.
(that line was not to be taken seriously. it was meant to mock economics itself. an uprise trend is always preferable, and thats what you have after you reach zero, there's no other way.)
but that would be the only possible solution for germany to even get out of the euro again and yet not have a major inclination in it's economic system IMO (that it is not realisable, since you won't get everyone within a day to switch jobs and do something else (and be successful at it) is for certain) :DD
the major upcoming problem of leavin euro and getting a new own currency would rather be the upward revaluation of this currency.. in fact we could import things pretty cheap. but we are mainly an export nation - tho exporting goods would become drastically more expensive for other countries, which in the end will lead to a shrinking economy here :/
basically everything is shit ;D seems like there has to be found a way to solve the problems as good as possible in this system we are currently running in :S
or as sac stated... lets start new world war
but neither is war, I'm sorry, at least not for 'us'. we'd get smashed big times. just let the US and...china for example have war. might have a positive effect not on national but on world economy at least maybe :P
and ye we prolly would get rolled hard by bangladesh or any other poor country in the world ^^
the EU is trying to save greece but america is worse & no1 is doin shit there :)
(not to mention that they're by far beyond salvation)
but the US itself is doin shit & it basicly started there
Secondly, Japan has a very low private debt (the japanese people barely have any personal debt) which means they can more easily handle a higher public debt ratio.
Thirdly, Japan's economy is in a better shape (allthough not that great either) then Greece, Italy, Portugal or Ireland.
And last but not least, Japan has a very big economy which means the tax base is much larger then Greece or Portugal. If they get in trouble, they can more easily raise taxes to fulfil their financial obligations (eg. finance their debt).
japan hasn't a very low private debt to me,italian private debt it's lower then japan.
private debts are another story.
Japan (the government that is) has a public debt of 225% so let's say a 10 trillion $ public debt. Because japanese save a lot, they buy japanese bunds. As far as I know, a huge majority of those bunds (90%??) are in japanese hands. Basically the government has 10 trillion $ debt which is in the hands of the japanese people themselves.
Italy has one of the lowest levels of private debt in the west but Japan aswell has a quite low private debt compared to the rest of the western world (indeed not as low as Italy afaik).
The problem for Italy is the lack of growth. Italy's economy grew at the lowest pace of all EU members in the last 10 years. Without growth, you can't pay down your debt and your debt burden becomes too big. Also, reforms in the labour market are urgently needed in Italy. Without these, economic growth will be even harder to achieve especially with the population becoming older, costs will increase, etc...
The fact is Italy has the 2nd highest public debt (120%) in the EU, a deficit of 4,5% which means Italy's debt becomes bigger every year. Add in the fact that Italy barely grows at all, you know why investors are questioning Italy's ability to pay down their debt. Also, Italy has a quite high tax rate alreaydy so it's harder to raise taxes even more which means there's less room to get money from the citizens to pay for the increasing debt.
The difference with the UK is that the UK has a growing economy, public debt is a lot lower (80%) then Italy's and they have more room to increase taxes, have a more dynamic economy,etc... but yes the UK has it's problems aswell, just not enough for investors to question their ability to pay down their debt.
A single interest rate across hugely divergent economies as well as population sizes proved a disaster for Ireland in particular.
It allowed a corrupt government(almost Berlusconi levels of corruption) to allow income tax revenues to fall below what was needed and replace that revenue with stamp duty on new houses, along with insane tax breaks for developers. When the inevitable construction crash came, well we all know what happened then.
No idea why I wrote all that tbh
(well not I, but germany)
My country went bankrupt, and it's almost chaos everywhere, still, I'm a rich sob and I don't give a flying fuck.
Unless you are poor like your government, I don't see why you should care.
If you have a few 100k euro or a few million, no, you shouldn't have a problem but otherwise I think you should :)
I don't have a problem ma boi.
It's srsbsns.
2)I'm very healthy, I don't drink alcohol.
3)I'm gay, don't need chicks.
4) How am I spending money by spamming cf?
Survivors ->
upcoming social order for the next few decades will be some environmental saving shit or something like that imo... those are the last breaths of capitalism.